A group of extremely pious folks










0















In the Talmud, I think it is in berachos, there is mentioned a group of extremely pious people. Does anyone know the name of this group?










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  • So it could be anywhere in the Talmud?

    – Dr. Shmuel
    Aug 27 '18 at 0:34
















0















In the Talmud, I think it is in berachos, there is mentioned a group of extremely pious people. Does anyone know the name of this group?










share|improve this question






















  • So it could be anywhere in the Talmud?

    – Dr. Shmuel
    Aug 27 '18 at 0:34














0












0








0








In the Talmud, I think it is in berachos, there is mentioned a group of extremely pious people. Does anyone know the name of this group?










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In the Talmud, I think it is in berachos, there is mentioned a group of extremely pious people. Does anyone know the name of this group?







talmud-gemara






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asked Aug 26 '18 at 23:29









Deborah LewisDeborah Lewis

323




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  • So it could be anywhere in the Talmud?

    – Dr. Shmuel
    Aug 27 '18 at 0:34


















  • So it could be anywhere in the Talmud?

    – Dr. Shmuel
    Aug 27 '18 at 0:34

















So it could be anywhere in the Talmud?

– Dr. Shmuel
Aug 27 '18 at 0:34






So it could be anywhere in the Talmud?

– Dr. Shmuel
Aug 27 '18 at 0:34











3 Answers
3






active

oldest

votes


















8














There is not much information in the question to go on, so this is hardly a definitive answer, but perhaps you are referring to the following:



Berachot 9b




העיד ר"י בן אליקים משום קהלא קדישא דבירושלים כל הסומך גאולה לתפלה אינו
נזוק כל היום כולו



R. Jose b. Eliakim testified in the name of the holy community of
Jerusalem: If one joins the ge'ullah to the tefillah, he will not meet
with any mishap for the whole of the day. (Soncino translation)




Thus, the group is called קהלא קדישא דבירושלים, or The Holy Community of Jerusalem.



There is another group mentioned on the same page:




אמר אביי לתפילין כאחרים לק"ש כותיקין דאמר ר' יוחנן ותיקין היו גומרין
אותה עם הנץ החמה תניא נמי הכי ותיקין היו גומרין אותה עם הנץ החמה כדי
שיסמוך גאולה לתפלה ונמצא מתפלל ביום



Abaye says: In regard to the tefillin, the halachah is as stated by
the ‘Others’; in regard to [the recital of] the Shema’, as practised
by the watikin. For R. Johanan said: The watikin used to finish it
[the recital of the Shema’] with sunrise, in order to join the
ge'ullah with the tefillah, and say the tefillah in the daytime.
(Soncino translation)




Here the name of the group is ותיקין, or Watikin. It is not entirely clear who/what this refers to. Rashi explains it as referring to humble men to whom the commandment is dear:




אנשים ענוים ומחבבין מצוה




The footnote in the above translation states:




Lit., strong’ (sc.,in piety), a title probably applied to certain men
who, in the time of the Hasmonean kingdom, set an example of
exceptional piety. Some identify them with the Essenes.




Alternatively, you might be referring to the following:



Berachot 32b




תנו רבנן חסידים הראשונים היו שוהין שעה אחת ומתפללין שעה אחת וחוזרין
ושוהין שעה אחת וכי מאחר ששוהין תשע שעות ביום בתפלה תורתן היאך משתמרת
ומלאכתן היאך נעשית אלא מתוך שחסידים הם תורתם משתמרת ומלאכתן מתברכת



Our Rabbis taught: The pious men of old used to wait for an hour and
pray for an hour and then wait again for an hour. But seeing that they
spend nine hours a day over prayer, how is their knowledge of Torah
preserved and how is their work done? [The answer is] that because
they are pious, their Torah is preserved and their work is blessed.
(Soncino translation)




In this case the name of the group is חסידים הראשונים, or The Pious Men of Old.






share|improve this answer
































    3














    Not in ברכות, but given the very vague parameters of the question, might it be the 36 hidden righteous mentioned in Sanhedrin 97b and Sukka 45b?




    Abaye said: The world has no fewer than thirty-six righteous people in
    each generation who greet the Divine Presence







    share|improve this answer
































      1














      A group of pious people called the "vatikin" (ותיקין) are mentioned on Berakhot 26a. As Rashi puts it, they are people who try extra hard to do mitzvot in their proper time, at the earliest possible.






      share|improve this answer


















      • 3





        This group is already mentioned in the other earlier answer

        – Double AA
        Aug 27 '18 at 12:20







      • 2





        @DoubleAA judaism.meta.stackexchange.com/a/2087/9682

        – DonielF
        Aug 27 '18 at 14:26


















      3 Answers
      3






      active

      oldest

      votes








      3 Answers
      3






      active

      oldest

      votes









      active

      oldest

      votes






      active

      oldest

      votes









      8














      There is not much information in the question to go on, so this is hardly a definitive answer, but perhaps you are referring to the following:



      Berachot 9b




      העיד ר"י בן אליקים משום קהלא קדישא דבירושלים כל הסומך גאולה לתפלה אינו
      נזוק כל היום כולו



      R. Jose b. Eliakim testified in the name of the holy community of
      Jerusalem: If one joins the ge'ullah to the tefillah, he will not meet
      with any mishap for the whole of the day. (Soncino translation)




      Thus, the group is called קהלא קדישא דבירושלים, or The Holy Community of Jerusalem.



      There is another group mentioned on the same page:




      אמר אביי לתפילין כאחרים לק"ש כותיקין דאמר ר' יוחנן ותיקין היו גומרין
      אותה עם הנץ החמה תניא נמי הכי ותיקין היו גומרין אותה עם הנץ החמה כדי
      שיסמוך גאולה לתפלה ונמצא מתפלל ביום



      Abaye says: In regard to the tefillin, the halachah is as stated by
      the ‘Others’; in regard to [the recital of] the Shema’, as practised
      by the watikin. For R. Johanan said: The watikin used to finish it
      [the recital of the Shema’] with sunrise, in order to join the
      ge'ullah with the tefillah, and say the tefillah in the daytime.
      (Soncino translation)




      Here the name of the group is ותיקין, or Watikin. It is not entirely clear who/what this refers to. Rashi explains it as referring to humble men to whom the commandment is dear:




      אנשים ענוים ומחבבין מצוה




      The footnote in the above translation states:




      Lit., strong’ (sc.,in piety), a title probably applied to certain men
      who, in the time of the Hasmonean kingdom, set an example of
      exceptional piety. Some identify them with the Essenes.




      Alternatively, you might be referring to the following:



      Berachot 32b




      תנו רבנן חסידים הראשונים היו שוהין שעה אחת ומתפללין שעה אחת וחוזרין
      ושוהין שעה אחת וכי מאחר ששוהין תשע שעות ביום בתפלה תורתן היאך משתמרת
      ומלאכתן היאך נעשית אלא מתוך שחסידים הם תורתם משתמרת ומלאכתן מתברכת



      Our Rabbis taught: The pious men of old used to wait for an hour and
      pray for an hour and then wait again for an hour. But seeing that they
      spend nine hours a day over prayer, how is their knowledge of Torah
      preserved and how is their work done? [The answer is] that because
      they are pious, their Torah is preserved and their work is blessed.
      (Soncino translation)




      In this case the name of the group is חסידים הראשונים, or The Pious Men of Old.






      share|improve this answer





























        8














        There is not much information in the question to go on, so this is hardly a definitive answer, but perhaps you are referring to the following:



        Berachot 9b




        העיד ר"י בן אליקים משום קהלא קדישא דבירושלים כל הסומך גאולה לתפלה אינו
        נזוק כל היום כולו



        R. Jose b. Eliakim testified in the name of the holy community of
        Jerusalem: If one joins the ge'ullah to the tefillah, he will not meet
        with any mishap for the whole of the day. (Soncino translation)




        Thus, the group is called קהלא קדישא דבירושלים, or The Holy Community of Jerusalem.



        There is another group mentioned on the same page:




        אמר אביי לתפילין כאחרים לק"ש כותיקין דאמר ר' יוחנן ותיקין היו גומרין
        אותה עם הנץ החמה תניא נמי הכי ותיקין היו גומרין אותה עם הנץ החמה כדי
        שיסמוך גאולה לתפלה ונמצא מתפלל ביום



        Abaye says: In regard to the tefillin, the halachah is as stated by
        the ‘Others’; in regard to [the recital of] the Shema’, as practised
        by the watikin. For R. Johanan said: The watikin used to finish it
        [the recital of the Shema’] with sunrise, in order to join the
        ge'ullah with the tefillah, and say the tefillah in the daytime.
        (Soncino translation)




        Here the name of the group is ותיקין, or Watikin. It is not entirely clear who/what this refers to. Rashi explains it as referring to humble men to whom the commandment is dear:




        אנשים ענוים ומחבבין מצוה




        The footnote in the above translation states:




        Lit., strong’ (sc.,in piety), a title probably applied to certain men
        who, in the time of the Hasmonean kingdom, set an example of
        exceptional piety. Some identify them with the Essenes.




        Alternatively, you might be referring to the following:



        Berachot 32b




        תנו רבנן חסידים הראשונים היו שוהין שעה אחת ומתפללין שעה אחת וחוזרין
        ושוהין שעה אחת וכי מאחר ששוהין תשע שעות ביום בתפלה תורתן היאך משתמרת
        ומלאכתן היאך נעשית אלא מתוך שחסידים הם תורתם משתמרת ומלאכתן מתברכת



        Our Rabbis taught: The pious men of old used to wait for an hour and
        pray for an hour and then wait again for an hour. But seeing that they
        spend nine hours a day over prayer, how is their knowledge of Torah
        preserved and how is their work done? [The answer is] that because
        they are pious, their Torah is preserved and their work is blessed.
        (Soncino translation)




        In this case the name of the group is חסידים הראשונים, or The Pious Men of Old.






        share|improve this answer



























          8












          8








          8







          There is not much information in the question to go on, so this is hardly a definitive answer, but perhaps you are referring to the following:



          Berachot 9b




          העיד ר"י בן אליקים משום קהלא קדישא דבירושלים כל הסומך גאולה לתפלה אינו
          נזוק כל היום כולו



          R. Jose b. Eliakim testified in the name of the holy community of
          Jerusalem: If one joins the ge'ullah to the tefillah, he will not meet
          with any mishap for the whole of the day. (Soncino translation)




          Thus, the group is called קהלא קדישא דבירושלים, or The Holy Community of Jerusalem.



          There is another group mentioned on the same page:




          אמר אביי לתפילין כאחרים לק"ש כותיקין דאמר ר' יוחנן ותיקין היו גומרין
          אותה עם הנץ החמה תניא נמי הכי ותיקין היו גומרין אותה עם הנץ החמה כדי
          שיסמוך גאולה לתפלה ונמצא מתפלל ביום



          Abaye says: In regard to the tefillin, the halachah is as stated by
          the ‘Others’; in regard to [the recital of] the Shema’, as practised
          by the watikin. For R. Johanan said: The watikin used to finish it
          [the recital of the Shema’] with sunrise, in order to join the
          ge'ullah with the tefillah, and say the tefillah in the daytime.
          (Soncino translation)




          Here the name of the group is ותיקין, or Watikin. It is not entirely clear who/what this refers to. Rashi explains it as referring to humble men to whom the commandment is dear:




          אנשים ענוים ומחבבין מצוה




          The footnote in the above translation states:




          Lit., strong’ (sc.,in piety), a title probably applied to certain men
          who, in the time of the Hasmonean kingdom, set an example of
          exceptional piety. Some identify them with the Essenes.




          Alternatively, you might be referring to the following:



          Berachot 32b




          תנו רבנן חסידים הראשונים היו שוהין שעה אחת ומתפללין שעה אחת וחוזרין
          ושוהין שעה אחת וכי מאחר ששוהין תשע שעות ביום בתפלה תורתן היאך משתמרת
          ומלאכתן היאך נעשית אלא מתוך שחסידים הם תורתם משתמרת ומלאכתן מתברכת



          Our Rabbis taught: The pious men of old used to wait for an hour and
          pray for an hour and then wait again for an hour. But seeing that they
          spend nine hours a day over prayer, how is their knowledge of Torah
          preserved and how is their work done? [The answer is] that because
          they are pious, their Torah is preserved and their work is blessed.
          (Soncino translation)




          In this case the name of the group is חסידים הראשונים, or The Pious Men of Old.






          share|improve this answer















          There is not much information in the question to go on, so this is hardly a definitive answer, but perhaps you are referring to the following:



          Berachot 9b




          העיד ר"י בן אליקים משום קהלא קדישא דבירושלים כל הסומך גאולה לתפלה אינו
          נזוק כל היום כולו



          R. Jose b. Eliakim testified in the name of the holy community of
          Jerusalem: If one joins the ge'ullah to the tefillah, he will not meet
          with any mishap for the whole of the day. (Soncino translation)




          Thus, the group is called קהלא קדישא דבירושלים, or The Holy Community of Jerusalem.



          There is another group mentioned on the same page:




          אמר אביי לתפילין כאחרים לק"ש כותיקין דאמר ר' יוחנן ותיקין היו גומרין
          אותה עם הנץ החמה תניא נמי הכי ותיקין היו גומרין אותה עם הנץ החמה כדי
          שיסמוך גאולה לתפלה ונמצא מתפלל ביום



          Abaye says: In regard to the tefillin, the halachah is as stated by
          the ‘Others’; in regard to [the recital of] the Shema’, as practised
          by the watikin. For R. Johanan said: The watikin used to finish it
          [the recital of the Shema’] with sunrise, in order to join the
          ge'ullah with the tefillah, and say the tefillah in the daytime.
          (Soncino translation)




          Here the name of the group is ותיקין, or Watikin. It is not entirely clear who/what this refers to. Rashi explains it as referring to humble men to whom the commandment is dear:




          אנשים ענוים ומחבבין מצוה




          The footnote in the above translation states:




          Lit., strong’ (sc.,in piety), a title probably applied to certain men
          who, in the time of the Hasmonean kingdom, set an example of
          exceptional piety. Some identify them with the Essenes.




          Alternatively, you might be referring to the following:



          Berachot 32b




          תנו רבנן חסידים הראשונים היו שוהין שעה אחת ומתפללין שעה אחת וחוזרין
          ושוהין שעה אחת וכי מאחר ששוהין תשע שעות ביום בתפלה תורתן היאך משתמרת
          ומלאכתן היאך נעשית אלא מתוך שחסידים הם תורתם משתמרת ומלאכתן מתברכת



          Our Rabbis taught: The pious men of old used to wait for an hour and
          pray for an hour and then wait again for an hour. But seeing that they
          spend nine hours a day over prayer, how is their knowledge of Torah
          preserved and how is their work done? [The answer is] that because
          they are pious, their Torah is preserved and their work is blessed.
          (Soncino translation)




          In this case the name of the group is חסידים הראשונים, or The Pious Men of Old.







          share|improve this answer














          share|improve this answer



          share|improve this answer








          edited Aug 27 '18 at 0:43

























          answered Aug 27 '18 at 0:00









          AlexAlex

          20.7k151121




          20.7k151121





















              3














              Not in ברכות, but given the very vague parameters of the question, might it be the 36 hidden righteous mentioned in Sanhedrin 97b and Sukka 45b?




              Abaye said: The world has no fewer than thirty-six righteous people in
              each generation who greet the Divine Presence







              share|improve this answer





























                3














                Not in ברכות, but given the very vague parameters of the question, might it be the 36 hidden righteous mentioned in Sanhedrin 97b and Sukka 45b?




                Abaye said: The world has no fewer than thirty-six righteous people in
                each generation who greet the Divine Presence







                share|improve this answer



























                  3












                  3








                  3







                  Not in ברכות, but given the very vague parameters of the question, might it be the 36 hidden righteous mentioned in Sanhedrin 97b and Sukka 45b?




                  Abaye said: The world has no fewer than thirty-six righteous people in
                  each generation who greet the Divine Presence







                  share|improve this answer















                  Not in ברכות, but given the very vague parameters of the question, might it be the 36 hidden righteous mentioned in Sanhedrin 97b and Sukka 45b?




                  Abaye said: The world has no fewer than thirty-six righteous people in
                  each generation who greet the Divine Presence








                  share|improve this answer














                  share|improve this answer



                  share|improve this answer








                  edited Aug 27 '18 at 14:07

























                  answered Aug 27 '18 at 14:02









                  Josh FriedlanderJosh Friedlander

                  89613




                  89613





















                      1














                      A group of pious people called the "vatikin" (ותיקין) are mentioned on Berakhot 26a. As Rashi puts it, they are people who try extra hard to do mitzvot in their proper time, at the earliest possible.






                      share|improve this answer


















                      • 3





                        This group is already mentioned in the other earlier answer

                        – Double AA
                        Aug 27 '18 at 12:20







                      • 2





                        @DoubleAA judaism.meta.stackexchange.com/a/2087/9682

                        – DonielF
                        Aug 27 '18 at 14:26















                      1














                      A group of pious people called the "vatikin" (ותיקין) are mentioned on Berakhot 26a. As Rashi puts it, they are people who try extra hard to do mitzvot in their proper time, at the earliest possible.






                      share|improve this answer


















                      • 3





                        This group is already mentioned in the other earlier answer

                        – Double AA
                        Aug 27 '18 at 12:20







                      • 2





                        @DoubleAA judaism.meta.stackexchange.com/a/2087/9682

                        – DonielF
                        Aug 27 '18 at 14:26













                      1












                      1








                      1







                      A group of pious people called the "vatikin" (ותיקין) are mentioned on Berakhot 26a. As Rashi puts it, they are people who try extra hard to do mitzvot in their proper time, at the earliest possible.






                      share|improve this answer













                      A group of pious people called the "vatikin" (ותיקין) are mentioned on Berakhot 26a. As Rashi puts it, they are people who try extra hard to do mitzvot in their proper time, at the earliest possible.







                      share|improve this answer












                      share|improve this answer



                      share|improve this answer










                      answered Aug 27 '18 at 2:35









                      ezraezra

                      11.1k21354




                      11.1k21354







                      • 3





                        This group is already mentioned in the other earlier answer

                        – Double AA
                        Aug 27 '18 at 12:20







                      • 2





                        @DoubleAA judaism.meta.stackexchange.com/a/2087/9682

                        – DonielF
                        Aug 27 '18 at 14:26












                      • 3





                        This group is already mentioned in the other earlier answer

                        – Double AA
                        Aug 27 '18 at 12:20







                      • 2





                        @DoubleAA judaism.meta.stackexchange.com/a/2087/9682

                        – DonielF
                        Aug 27 '18 at 14:26







                      3




                      3





                      This group is already mentioned in the other earlier answer

                      – Double AA
                      Aug 27 '18 at 12:20






                      This group is already mentioned in the other earlier answer

                      – Double AA
                      Aug 27 '18 at 12:20





                      2




                      2





                      @DoubleAA judaism.meta.stackexchange.com/a/2087/9682

                      – DonielF
                      Aug 27 '18 at 14:26





                      @DoubleAA judaism.meta.stackexchange.com/a/2087/9682

                      – DonielF
                      Aug 27 '18 at 14:26



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