How do I find an immigration lawyer/solicitor to help with my UK Visa application?










7














I'm in the United States and I need help preparing an application for a UK visa. Finding a solicitor/immigration lawyer or the appropriate person to help a US Citizen apply for a UK Visa has proven to be very difficult to find.



Does anyone know where abouts I could find this sort of help? What to search for? Website links? Reputable recommendations? I want to do everything right!.










share|improve this question



















  • 2




    With your earlier Q's and the answers (particularly from @GayotFow), have you gone to the Law Society web site. Practice area: Immigration?
    – Giorgio
    Mar 3 '17 at 0:18
















7














I'm in the United States and I need help preparing an application for a UK visa. Finding a solicitor/immigration lawyer or the appropriate person to help a US Citizen apply for a UK Visa has proven to be very difficult to find.



Does anyone know where abouts I could find this sort of help? What to search for? Website links? Reputable recommendations? I want to do everything right!.










share|improve this question



















  • 2




    With your earlier Q's and the answers (particularly from @GayotFow), have you gone to the Law Society web site. Practice area: Immigration?
    – Giorgio
    Mar 3 '17 at 0:18














7












7








7


2





I'm in the United States and I need help preparing an application for a UK visa. Finding a solicitor/immigration lawyer or the appropriate person to help a US Citizen apply for a UK Visa has proven to be very difficult to find.



Does anyone know where abouts I could find this sort of help? What to search for? Website links? Reputable recommendations? I want to do everything right!.










share|improve this question















I'm in the United States and I need help preparing an application for a UK visa. Finding a solicitor/immigration lawyer or the appropriate person to help a US Citizen apply for a UK Visa has proven to be very difficult to find.



Does anyone know where abouts I could find this sort of help? What to search for? Website links? Reputable recommendations? I want to do everything right!.







visas uk legal applications






share|improve this question















share|improve this question













share|improve this question




share|improve this question








edited Mar 3 '17 at 6:46









JoErNanO

43.9k12136223




43.9k12136223










asked Mar 2 '17 at 23:45









Kate

571




571







  • 2




    With your earlier Q's and the answers (particularly from @GayotFow), have you gone to the Law Society web site. Practice area: Immigration?
    – Giorgio
    Mar 3 '17 at 0:18













  • 2




    With your earlier Q's and the answers (particularly from @GayotFow), have you gone to the Law Society web site. Practice area: Immigration?
    – Giorgio
    Mar 3 '17 at 0:18








2




2




With your earlier Q's and the answers (particularly from @GayotFow), have you gone to the Law Society web site. Practice area: Immigration?
– Giorgio
Mar 3 '17 at 0:18





With your earlier Q's and the answers (particularly from @GayotFow), have you gone to the Law Society web site. Practice area: Immigration?
– Giorgio
Mar 3 '17 at 0:18











1 Answer
1






active

oldest

votes


















13














You are in the US and contemplate applying for a Standard Visitor Visa.




Does anyone know where abouts I could find this sort of help?




The first step is to determine if your case is 'complex' or 'straight-forward'. It's an important step. You can determine this by having a consultation with a solicitor. During the consultation the meter is running so it's best to prepare yourself: get scans of your evidence and write a brief summary of your personal circumstances.



Solicitors are regulated by the Solicitors Regulation Authority and accredited by the Law Society. Importantly, solicitors are required by law to refuse casework that is hopeless and they can get into serious trouble for it. They are also required to tell you if your case is 'complex' or 'straight-forward' and similarly they can get into trouble by making the wrong diagnosis.



The consultation is normally handled by email and telephone and sometimes Skype. If your case is 'straight-forward', they may tell you to do it yourself. If they tell you that your case is 'complex', it means you should proceed with extreme caution. In either case they may offer to take you under client care. If they take you under client care they have to send you a written letter confirming the cost and scope. As an example, Vicki will give you a solid consultation for £100. Barry's consultations start at about £350, but he specialises in cases involving deception, overstaying, and removals. Ian will give a consultation for about £200; he relies on 20 years experience as an Immigration Officer at Heathrow.




What to search for? Website links? Reputable recommendations?




Immigration help comes in two flavours: advisers and solicitors. These are listed at...



  • The Immigration Law Practitioner's Association (ILPA)

  • The UK Law Society

  • The Commissioner's register

You can also simply call a high street firm and explain what you're after, some of these are...



  • Wesley Gyrk

  • Kingsley Napley

  • Laura Devine

  • Ian Westwood

  • Penningtons

It is not spam to list these because they are widely acknowledged as industry leaders and each of them has a history of testifying before Parliament or dealing with the UKVI at the ministerial level. They also have heavyweight muscle when it comes to applications (i.e., no refusals). Because of all that, they are expensive (we're talking serious coin here) and sometimes it's hard to get on their calendars. As an example, I saw Sophie represent a visitor visa application for a woman with two prior refusals and an inland removal at public expense (yikes!). It cost £3,800.




Doc Checks;



If your case is straight-forward but you want to make sure your application is bullet-proof, you can arrange for a 'doc check'. It means a practitioner will take your completed application and all your evidence and give you some light feedback on it. Remember that it's light-weight and not for 'complex' cases. I saw that Colin Yeo (who's cool) is offering a doc check for £249. There are others out there and it's fine to ask a practitioner for a doc check during your consultation. I knew an adviser who did reasonably sound doc check for £80. Comparatively, Vicki's doc checks cost £500 but she's heavily detail-oriented and bullet-proof exhaustive.




Notes:



  • I can say this explicitly: avoid using the UKVI helpline.

  • Avoid forums and discussion boards for anything other than simple
    advice.

  • Let's say as a working figure 98% of applicants do not need a
    practitioner. The whole system is designed for normal people who can
    fill out the form and submit their stuff. It's simple and universally
    accessible.

  • Specifically for you, Kate, your case is 'complex', it's apparent in
    your history and a solicitor will tell this immediately. You can just tell them outright, "I have a case with awkward complexities". They will know what to do after that. And whatever you do, don't use straight-forward tactics. You will likely be refused again if you do.

Disclaimer:



I am aligned with the school of thought that solicitors should be used whenever the applicant's case is complex. Regardless of the cost, a solicitor can prevent refusals and as we know, refusals are a permanent burden on a person's history. Further disclaiming, I know all of those mentioned above personally, and for a long time.






share|improve this answer


















  • 1




    Why should one avoid the UKVI helpline?
    – phoog
    Mar 3 '17 at 3:30






  • 1




    Excellent answer! We should a link to this question to round up all our future canonicals.
    – JonathanReez
    Mar 3 '17 at 6:26










  • Could you also add a section on barristers? You often mention that one 'needs to find a solicitor to instruct a barrister' - what does that mean?
    – JonathanReez
    Mar 3 '17 at 6:46






  • 1




    @phoog see travel.stackexchange.com/questions/47975/…
    – Gayot Fow
    Mar 3 '17 at 9:57










  • @phoog Because a lot of the staff are absolute noobs - I can testify to that
    – Crazydre
    Oct 5 '17 at 23:05










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1 Answer
1






active

oldest

votes








1 Answer
1






active

oldest

votes









active

oldest

votes






active

oldest

votes









13














You are in the US and contemplate applying for a Standard Visitor Visa.




Does anyone know where abouts I could find this sort of help?




The first step is to determine if your case is 'complex' or 'straight-forward'. It's an important step. You can determine this by having a consultation with a solicitor. During the consultation the meter is running so it's best to prepare yourself: get scans of your evidence and write a brief summary of your personal circumstances.



Solicitors are regulated by the Solicitors Regulation Authority and accredited by the Law Society. Importantly, solicitors are required by law to refuse casework that is hopeless and they can get into serious trouble for it. They are also required to tell you if your case is 'complex' or 'straight-forward' and similarly they can get into trouble by making the wrong diagnosis.



The consultation is normally handled by email and telephone and sometimes Skype. If your case is 'straight-forward', they may tell you to do it yourself. If they tell you that your case is 'complex', it means you should proceed with extreme caution. In either case they may offer to take you under client care. If they take you under client care they have to send you a written letter confirming the cost and scope. As an example, Vicki will give you a solid consultation for £100. Barry's consultations start at about £350, but he specialises in cases involving deception, overstaying, and removals. Ian will give a consultation for about £200; he relies on 20 years experience as an Immigration Officer at Heathrow.




What to search for? Website links? Reputable recommendations?




Immigration help comes in two flavours: advisers and solicitors. These are listed at...



  • The Immigration Law Practitioner's Association (ILPA)

  • The UK Law Society

  • The Commissioner's register

You can also simply call a high street firm and explain what you're after, some of these are...



  • Wesley Gyrk

  • Kingsley Napley

  • Laura Devine

  • Ian Westwood

  • Penningtons

It is not spam to list these because they are widely acknowledged as industry leaders and each of them has a history of testifying before Parliament or dealing with the UKVI at the ministerial level. They also have heavyweight muscle when it comes to applications (i.e., no refusals). Because of all that, they are expensive (we're talking serious coin here) and sometimes it's hard to get on their calendars. As an example, I saw Sophie represent a visitor visa application for a woman with two prior refusals and an inland removal at public expense (yikes!). It cost £3,800.




Doc Checks;



If your case is straight-forward but you want to make sure your application is bullet-proof, you can arrange for a 'doc check'. It means a practitioner will take your completed application and all your evidence and give you some light feedback on it. Remember that it's light-weight and not for 'complex' cases. I saw that Colin Yeo (who's cool) is offering a doc check for £249. There are others out there and it's fine to ask a practitioner for a doc check during your consultation. I knew an adviser who did reasonably sound doc check for £80. Comparatively, Vicki's doc checks cost £500 but she's heavily detail-oriented and bullet-proof exhaustive.




Notes:



  • I can say this explicitly: avoid using the UKVI helpline.

  • Avoid forums and discussion boards for anything other than simple
    advice.

  • Let's say as a working figure 98% of applicants do not need a
    practitioner. The whole system is designed for normal people who can
    fill out the form and submit their stuff. It's simple and universally
    accessible.

  • Specifically for you, Kate, your case is 'complex', it's apparent in
    your history and a solicitor will tell this immediately. You can just tell them outright, "I have a case with awkward complexities". They will know what to do after that. And whatever you do, don't use straight-forward tactics. You will likely be refused again if you do.

Disclaimer:



I am aligned with the school of thought that solicitors should be used whenever the applicant's case is complex. Regardless of the cost, a solicitor can prevent refusals and as we know, refusals are a permanent burden on a person's history. Further disclaiming, I know all of those mentioned above personally, and for a long time.






share|improve this answer


















  • 1




    Why should one avoid the UKVI helpline?
    – phoog
    Mar 3 '17 at 3:30






  • 1




    Excellent answer! We should a link to this question to round up all our future canonicals.
    – JonathanReez
    Mar 3 '17 at 6:26










  • Could you also add a section on barristers? You often mention that one 'needs to find a solicitor to instruct a barrister' - what does that mean?
    – JonathanReez
    Mar 3 '17 at 6:46






  • 1




    @phoog see travel.stackexchange.com/questions/47975/…
    – Gayot Fow
    Mar 3 '17 at 9:57










  • @phoog Because a lot of the staff are absolute noobs - I can testify to that
    – Crazydre
    Oct 5 '17 at 23:05















13














You are in the US and contemplate applying for a Standard Visitor Visa.




Does anyone know where abouts I could find this sort of help?




The first step is to determine if your case is 'complex' or 'straight-forward'. It's an important step. You can determine this by having a consultation with a solicitor. During the consultation the meter is running so it's best to prepare yourself: get scans of your evidence and write a brief summary of your personal circumstances.



Solicitors are regulated by the Solicitors Regulation Authority and accredited by the Law Society. Importantly, solicitors are required by law to refuse casework that is hopeless and they can get into serious trouble for it. They are also required to tell you if your case is 'complex' or 'straight-forward' and similarly they can get into trouble by making the wrong diagnosis.



The consultation is normally handled by email and telephone and sometimes Skype. If your case is 'straight-forward', they may tell you to do it yourself. If they tell you that your case is 'complex', it means you should proceed with extreme caution. In either case they may offer to take you under client care. If they take you under client care they have to send you a written letter confirming the cost and scope. As an example, Vicki will give you a solid consultation for £100. Barry's consultations start at about £350, but he specialises in cases involving deception, overstaying, and removals. Ian will give a consultation for about £200; he relies on 20 years experience as an Immigration Officer at Heathrow.




What to search for? Website links? Reputable recommendations?




Immigration help comes in two flavours: advisers and solicitors. These are listed at...



  • The Immigration Law Practitioner's Association (ILPA)

  • The UK Law Society

  • The Commissioner's register

You can also simply call a high street firm and explain what you're after, some of these are...



  • Wesley Gyrk

  • Kingsley Napley

  • Laura Devine

  • Ian Westwood

  • Penningtons

It is not spam to list these because they are widely acknowledged as industry leaders and each of them has a history of testifying before Parliament or dealing with the UKVI at the ministerial level. They also have heavyweight muscle when it comes to applications (i.e., no refusals). Because of all that, they are expensive (we're talking serious coin here) and sometimes it's hard to get on their calendars. As an example, I saw Sophie represent a visitor visa application for a woman with two prior refusals and an inland removal at public expense (yikes!). It cost £3,800.




Doc Checks;



If your case is straight-forward but you want to make sure your application is bullet-proof, you can arrange for a 'doc check'. It means a practitioner will take your completed application and all your evidence and give you some light feedback on it. Remember that it's light-weight and not for 'complex' cases. I saw that Colin Yeo (who's cool) is offering a doc check for £249. There are others out there and it's fine to ask a practitioner for a doc check during your consultation. I knew an adviser who did reasonably sound doc check for £80. Comparatively, Vicki's doc checks cost £500 but she's heavily detail-oriented and bullet-proof exhaustive.




Notes:



  • I can say this explicitly: avoid using the UKVI helpline.

  • Avoid forums and discussion boards for anything other than simple
    advice.

  • Let's say as a working figure 98% of applicants do not need a
    practitioner. The whole system is designed for normal people who can
    fill out the form and submit their stuff. It's simple and universally
    accessible.

  • Specifically for you, Kate, your case is 'complex', it's apparent in
    your history and a solicitor will tell this immediately. You can just tell them outright, "I have a case with awkward complexities". They will know what to do after that. And whatever you do, don't use straight-forward tactics. You will likely be refused again if you do.

Disclaimer:



I am aligned with the school of thought that solicitors should be used whenever the applicant's case is complex. Regardless of the cost, a solicitor can prevent refusals and as we know, refusals are a permanent burden on a person's history. Further disclaiming, I know all of those mentioned above personally, and for a long time.






share|improve this answer


















  • 1




    Why should one avoid the UKVI helpline?
    – phoog
    Mar 3 '17 at 3:30






  • 1




    Excellent answer! We should a link to this question to round up all our future canonicals.
    – JonathanReez
    Mar 3 '17 at 6:26










  • Could you also add a section on barristers? You often mention that one 'needs to find a solicitor to instruct a barrister' - what does that mean?
    – JonathanReez
    Mar 3 '17 at 6:46






  • 1




    @phoog see travel.stackexchange.com/questions/47975/…
    – Gayot Fow
    Mar 3 '17 at 9:57










  • @phoog Because a lot of the staff are absolute noobs - I can testify to that
    – Crazydre
    Oct 5 '17 at 23:05













13












13








13






You are in the US and contemplate applying for a Standard Visitor Visa.




Does anyone know where abouts I could find this sort of help?




The first step is to determine if your case is 'complex' or 'straight-forward'. It's an important step. You can determine this by having a consultation with a solicitor. During the consultation the meter is running so it's best to prepare yourself: get scans of your evidence and write a brief summary of your personal circumstances.



Solicitors are regulated by the Solicitors Regulation Authority and accredited by the Law Society. Importantly, solicitors are required by law to refuse casework that is hopeless and they can get into serious trouble for it. They are also required to tell you if your case is 'complex' or 'straight-forward' and similarly they can get into trouble by making the wrong diagnosis.



The consultation is normally handled by email and telephone and sometimes Skype. If your case is 'straight-forward', they may tell you to do it yourself. If they tell you that your case is 'complex', it means you should proceed with extreme caution. In either case they may offer to take you under client care. If they take you under client care they have to send you a written letter confirming the cost and scope. As an example, Vicki will give you a solid consultation for £100. Barry's consultations start at about £350, but he specialises in cases involving deception, overstaying, and removals. Ian will give a consultation for about £200; he relies on 20 years experience as an Immigration Officer at Heathrow.




What to search for? Website links? Reputable recommendations?




Immigration help comes in two flavours: advisers and solicitors. These are listed at...



  • The Immigration Law Practitioner's Association (ILPA)

  • The UK Law Society

  • The Commissioner's register

You can also simply call a high street firm and explain what you're after, some of these are...



  • Wesley Gyrk

  • Kingsley Napley

  • Laura Devine

  • Ian Westwood

  • Penningtons

It is not spam to list these because they are widely acknowledged as industry leaders and each of them has a history of testifying before Parliament or dealing with the UKVI at the ministerial level. They also have heavyweight muscle when it comes to applications (i.e., no refusals). Because of all that, they are expensive (we're talking serious coin here) and sometimes it's hard to get on their calendars. As an example, I saw Sophie represent a visitor visa application for a woman with two prior refusals and an inland removal at public expense (yikes!). It cost £3,800.




Doc Checks;



If your case is straight-forward but you want to make sure your application is bullet-proof, you can arrange for a 'doc check'. It means a practitioner will take your completed application and all your evidence and give you some light feedback on it. Remember that it's light-weight and not for 'complex' cases. I saw that Colin Yeo (who's cool) is offering a doc check for £249. There are others out there and it's fine to ask a practitioner for a doc check during your consultation. I knew an adviser who did reasonably sound doc check for £80. Comparatively, Vicki's doc checks cost £500 but she's heavily detail-oriented and bullet-proof exhaustive.




Notes:



  • I can say this explicitly: avoid using the UKVI helpline.

  • Avoid forums and discussion boards for anything other than simple
    advice.

  • Let's say as a working figure 98% of applicants do not need a
    practitioner. The whole system is designed for normal people who can
    fill out the form and submit their stuff. It's simple and universally
    accessible.

  • Specifically for you, Kate, your case is 'complex', it's apparent in
    your history and a solicitor will tell this immediately. You can just tell them outright, "I have a case with awkward complexities". They will know what to do after that. And whatever you do, don't use straight-forward tactics. You will likely be refused again if you do.

Disclaimer:



I am aligned with the school of thought that solicitors should be used whenever the applicant's case is complex. Regardless of the cost, a solicitor can prevent refusals and as we know, refusals are a permanent burden on a person's history. Further disclaiming, I know all of those mentioned above personally, and for a long time.






share|improve this answer














You are in the US and contemplate applying for a Standard Visitor Visa.




Does anyone know where abouts I could find this sort of help?




The first step is to determine if your case is 'complex' or 'straight-forward'. It's an important step. You can determine this by having a consultation with a solicitor. During the consultation the meter is running so it's best to prepare yourself: get scans of your evidence and write a brief summary of your personal circumstances.



Solicitors are regulated by the Solicitors Regulation Authority and accredited by the Law Society. Importantly, solicitors are required by law to refuse casework that is hopeless and they can get into serious trouble for it. They are also required to tell you if your case is 'complex' or 'straight-forward' and similarly they can get into trouble by making the wrong diagnosis.



The consultation is normally handled by email and telephone and sometimes Skype. If your case is 'straight-forward', they may tell you to do it yourself. If they tell you that your case is 'complex', it means you should proceed with extreme caution. In either case they may offer to take you under client care. If they take you under client care they have to send you a written letter confirming the cost and scope. As an example, Vicki will give you a solid consultation for £100. Barry's consultations start at about £350, but he specialises in cases involving deception, overstaying, and removals. Ian will give a consultation for about £200; he relies on 20 years experience as an Immigration Officer at Heathrow.




What to search for? Website links? Reputable recommendations?




Immigration help comes in two flavours: advisers and solicitors. These are listed at...



  • The Immigration Law Practitioner's Association (ILPA)

  • The UK Law Society

  • The Commissioner's register

You can also simply call a high street firm and explain what you're after, some of these are...



  • Wesley Gyrk

  • Kingsley Napley

  • Laura Devine

  • Ian Westwood

  • Penningtons

It is not spam to list these because they are widely acknowledged as industry leaders and each of them has a history of testifying before Parliament or dealing with the UKVI at the ministerial level. They also have heavyweight muscle when it comes to applications (i.e., no refusals). Because of all that, they are expensive (we're talking serious coin here) and sometimes it's hard to get on their calendars. As an example, I saw Sophie represent a visitor visa application for a woman with two prior refusals and an inland removal at public expense (yikes!). It cost £3,800.




Doc Checks;



If your case is straight-forward but you want to make sure your application is bullet-proof, you can arrange for a 'doc check'. It means a practitioner will take your completed application and all your evidence and give you some light feedback on it. Remember that it's light-weight and not for 'complex' cases. I saw that Colin Yeo (who's cool) is offering a doc check for £249. There are others out there and it's fine to ask a practitioner for a doc check during your consultation. I knew an adviser who did reasonably sound doc check for £80. Comparatively, Vicki's doc checks cost £500 but she's heavily detail-oriented and bullet-proof exhaustive.




Notes:



  • I can say this explicitly: avoid using the UKVI helpline.

  • Avoid forums and discussion boards for anything other than simple
    advice.

  • Let's say as a working figure 98% of applicants do not need a
    practitioner. The whole system is designed for normal people who can
    fill out the form and submit their stuff. It's simple and universally
    accessible.

  • Specifically for you, Kate, your case is 'complex', it's apparent in
    your history and a solicitor will tell this immediately. You can just tell them outright, "I have a case with awkward complexities". They will know what to do after that. And whatever you do, don't use straight-forward tactics. You will likely be refused again if you do.

Disclaimer:



I am aligned with the school of thought that solicitors should be used whenever the applicant's case is complex. Regardless of the cost, a solicitor can prevent refusals and as we know, refusals are a permanent burden on a person's history. Further disclaiming, I know all of those mentioned above personally, and for a long time.







share|improve this answer














share|improve this answer



share|improve this answer








edited Apr 13 '17 at 12:52









Community

1




1










answered Mar 3 '17 at 1:06









Gayot Fow

75.2k21197379




75.2k21197379







  • 1




    Why should one avoid the UKVI helpline?
    – phoog
    Mar 3 '17 at 3:30






  • 1




    Excellent answer! We should a link to this question to round up all our future canonicals.
    – JonathanReez
    Mar 3 '17 at 6:26










  • Could you also add a section on barristers? You often mention that one 'needs to find a solicitor to instruct a barrister' - what does that mean?
    – JonathanReez
    Mar 3 '17 at 6:46






  • 1




    @phoog see travel.stackexchange.com/questions/47975/…
    – Gayot Fow
    Mar 3 '17 at 9:57










  • @phoog Because a lot of the staff are absolute noobs - I can testify to that
    – Crazydre
    Oct 5 '17 at 23:05












  • 1




    Why should one avoid the UKVI helpline?
    – phoog
    Mar 3 '17 at 3:30






  • 1




    Excellent answer! We should a link to this question to round up all our future canonicals.
    – JonathanReez
    Mar 3 '17 at 6:26










  • Could you also add a section on barristers? You often mention that one 'needs to find a solicitor to instruct a barrister' - what does that mean?
    – JonathanReez
    Mar 3 '17 at 6:46






  • 1




    @phoog see travel.stackexchange.com/questions/47975/…
    – Gayot Fow
    Mar 3 '17 at 9:57










  • @phoog Because a lot of the staff are absolute noobs - I can testify to that
    – Crazydre
    Oct 5 '17 at 23:05







1




1




Why should one avoid the UKVI helpline?
– phoog
Mar 3 '17 at 3:30




Why should one avoid the UKVI helpline?
– phoog
Mar 3 '17 at 3:30




1




1




Excellent answer! We should a link to this question to round up all our future canonicals.
– JonathanReez
Mar 3 '17 at 6:26




Excellent answer! We should a link to this question to round up all our future canonicals.
– JonathanReez
Mar 3 '17 at 6:26












Could you also add a section on barristers? You often mention that one 'needs to find a solicitor to instruct a barrister' - what does that mean?
– JonathanReez
Mar 3 '17 at 6:46




Could you also add a section on barristers? You often mention that one 'needs to find a solicitor to instruct a barrister' - what does that mean?
– JonathanReez
Mar 3 '17 at 6:46




1




1




@phoog see travel.stackexchange.com/questions/47975/…
– Gayot Fow
Mar 3 '17 at 9:57




@phoog see travel.stackexchange.com/questions/47975/…
– Gayot Fow
Mar 3 '17 at 9:57












@phoog Because a lot of the staff are absolute noobs - I can testify to that
– Crazydre
Oct 5 '17 at 23:05




@phoog Because a lot of the staff are absolute noobs - I can testify to that
– Crazydre
Oct 5 '17 at 23:05

















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