Can a teenage Ethiopian legally drink in other countries using their ID?









up vote
28
down vote

favorite
2












The current year in Ethiopia is 2009 as they use something similar to the Julian calendar.



Could this mean that an Ethiopian born in 1995 (using their calendar), could present their passport/driver's license/other form of national ID in say, the USA, and show evidence that they're '22', even they're only 14 years old?










share|improve this question



















  • 1




    Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
    – JoErNanO
    Jul 20 '17 at 8:57














up vote
28
down vote

favorite
2












The current year in Ethiopia is 2009 as they use something similar to the Julian calendar.



Could this mean that an Ethiopian born in 1995 (using their calendar), could present their passport/driver's license/other form of national ID in say, the USA, and show evidence that they're '22', even they're only 14 years old?










share|improve this question



















  • 1




    Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
    – JoErNanO
    Jul 20 '17 at 8:57












up vote
28
down vote

favorite
2









up vote
28
down vote

favorite
2






2





The current year in Ethiopia is 2009 as they use something similar to the Julian calendar.



Could this mean that an Ethiopian born in 1995 (using their calendar), could present their passport/driver's license/other form of national ID in say, the USA, and show evidence that they're '22', even they're only 14 years old?










share|improve this question















The current year in Ethiopia is 2009 as they use something similar to the Julian calendar.



Could this mean that an Ethiopian born in 1995 (using their calendar), could present their passport/driver's license/other form of national ID in say, the USA, and show evidence that they're '22', even they're only 14 years old?







passports legal factoids ethiopian-citizens






share|improve this question















share|improve this question













share|improve this question




share|improve this question








edited Jul 18 '17 at 17:49









idmean

1133




1133










asked Jul 18 '17 at 2:03









Mark Mayo

129k755581273




129k755581273







  • 1




    Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
    – JoErNanO
    Jul 20 '17 at 8:57












  • 1




    Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
    – JoErNanO
    Jul 20 '17 at 8:57







1




1




Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
– JoErNanO
Jul 20 '17 at 8:57




Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
– JoErNanO
Jul 20 '17 at 8:57










7 Answers
7






active

oldest

votes

















up vote
24
down vote













According to ICAO 9303 Machine Readable Travel Documents:




Dates in the VIZ of the MRTD shall be entered in accordance with the Gregorian calendar




So if Ethiopian travel documents conform to ICAO standards (one would assume that they do, in order to be useful for international travel), Gregorian dates would appear at least in the machine readable section.



Also mentioned in that document:




The month may alternatively be printed in numerical form at the discretion of the issuing State or organization,
particularly where this might facilitate the use of the MRTD by States using other than the Gregorian calendar. In this
case the date would be written DDbMMbYY or DDbMMbYYYY, where b = a single blank space.




I'm not quite sure how the use of numeric month names actually facilitates use of non-Gregorian calendars in practice.






share|improve this answer




















  • Re: "I'm not quite sure how the use of numeric month names actually facilitates use of non-Gregorian calendars in practice": If I'm interpreting it right, the idea is that if a State doesn't use the Gregorian calendar, then it may have difficulty with the "printed in full in the national language [...] or abbreviated" option. (Quick: what's the English name for the third month of the Hebrew calendar?)
    – ruakh
    Jul 18 '17 at 5:42






  • 10




    @ruakh Which third month? ;)
    – Scimonster
    Jul 18 '17 at 8:43






  • 4




    This article indicates that Ethiopian driving licenses indeed use Gregorian dates. It's published in 2013 (surely Gregorian), and mentions pre-2008 licnenses, which again must be Gregorian, as Ethiopian 2008 was in the future in 2013.
    – ugoren
    Jul 18 '17 at 10:45

















up vote
15
down vote













From a practical standpoint, a person using an Ethiopian passport in the USA might have trouble with people even recognizing it as a legal document, depending on where you go. A lot of Americans have never seen a passport and literally don't know what it is when presented with one. Most of the time people who aren't sure about what they are looking at will assume that if you are showing this document as proof of age it must be right, but it's possible that you will run into someone that refuses to serve you.



I took my British husband to visit the US a few years ago, and we went to buy some beer at a public event in Pueblo, CO. The security person in charge of checking ID was adamant that he had to have a state-issued ID (that is, an American driver's license or ID card) even though he was obviously a foreign tourist and we were both clearly in our 30s. She didn't think his British passport was valid ID. I was eventually able to convince her by showing my US passport as comparison but it took some arguing.






share|improve this answer
















  • 16




    That's kinda terrifying...
    – Mark Mayo
    Jul 18 '17 at 9:01






  • 13




    But a British passport is a state-issued ID. The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland is a state. It's just not a state of the USA.
    – Mike Scott
    Jul 18 '17 at 9:29










  • Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
    – JonathanReez
    Jul 19 '17 at 10:05






  • 3




    @MikeScott, that's a use of the word state that many Americans are not aware of.
    – The Photon
    Jul 19 '17 at 16:24






  • 2




    Keep in mind that state (US state, not nation-state) auditors are absurdly draconian when it comes to ID checks, so the bouncer may have been trained not to take documents if he hasn't personally seen a valid version of it. Obviously it would be better service to just say that and ask for your patience while he clears it with a manager, but bouncers aren't hired to be personable.
    – IllusiveBrian
    Jul 19 '17 at 18:37

















up vote
12
down vote













Of course you cannot legally drink if you are too young. What counts is your age, not a number printed in your passport.



In practice, if you are 17 years old and 18 is required, the number in your passport will falsely indicate that you are 25. Most people will not know about Ethiopian passports and will not know how to identify them. If your passport seems to say "25" and your real age is 17, they will take one look at you and conclude that the passport is a forgery. Which is wrong, but you won't be served alcohol.



You will also have trouble getting alcohol if you are old enough (say 18), and your passport looks like saying you are 26. Again they will assume that the passport is forged and not serve you alcohol, because you don't look like you might be 26.



In many countries, there are severe consequences for someone being caught selling alcohol to someone below the legal age, so nobody will be willing to take the slightest risk. No sane person will sell alcohol to someone who doesn't look 18 and has a passport showing an age of 25, if selling to a minor and getting caught means losing your job, a major fine for the store or bar, and possibly loss of license. In addition with a passport where they have no idea how to check whether it is genuine or not.



@Josef: When you sell alcohol, it's not your job to guess the buyers age correctly. Your job is to make 100% sure that you don't sell to anyone under the legal age. For example, in the UK: "A person commits an offence under section 146 if he sells alcohol to a child under 18." It's a defence if no reasonable person could have thought that that the person is under 18. If you can't guess the buyers age correctly, you can't sell. Punished with a fine up to £5,000.



And there are no exceptions for black kids because you don't want to look racist. Since the whole reason for the rules is that it's dangerous for kids to consume alcohol, I'd say that selling to black kids and not to white ones is racist, not the other way round. You can tell in court "I sold alcohol to these 17 year old kids because they were black and I didn't want to appear racist". The court will say "So you knew they were under 18 and still sold them alcohol. Ok, that's a £5,000 fine. Next time check their age and not their colour. That's because black kids need to be protected just as much as white kids".






share|improve this answer


















  • 7




    If your passport seems to say "25" and your real age is 17, they will take one look at you and conclude that the passport is a forgery. I doubt so, maybe sometimes, but this implication is not true. Most of the time they will not bother, they were presented an ID and they are covered. Besides, 20 years ago we were drinking underage all the time but that might have changed.
    – Vladimir F
    Jul 18 '17 at 8:35






  • 9




    Also most people from Ethiopia propably don't look caucasian which would 1. make it harder for people mostly surrounded by caucasians to guess their age correctly and 2. people would probably afraid to say anything even if they assumed the person looks too young because it could look like racism.
    – Josef
    Jul 18 '17 at 8:44






  • 2




    Note to the changed answer: Right, it is not the job of the sales person to guess the age correctly. That's exactly my point. They get shown a passport which says the person is born 1998. They sell alcohol. End of story. Almost no one will start with "well, the passport says she is 19 but to me she looks more like 16, I should not sell". The job is to sell stuff. The law says, check that the buyer is >=18. The passport says, she is. End of story! Especially if the sales person has not much experience with estimating the age of non-caucasian people.
    – Josef
    Jul 18 '17 at 12:31











  • @Josef. As a good example of that, my brother-in-law never got carded when he was under age, but my best friend still does sometimes, despite being in his early thirties now. They are both Ethiopian. To be fair, the former was over 6' tall with a goatee since he was 16, the latter still has a baby face, so I would not call it racism in this case.
    – Mad Physicist
    Jul 18 '17 at 15:15










  • @VladimirF, In some jurisdictions, when selling alcohol, it is the legal responsibility of the person checking the ID to identify IDs that are forgeries (regardless of the fact that detecting a forgery might very difficult). Thus, in many situations just that you asked for ID, looked at it and it stated they were over the legal age is not sufficient to prevent the checker/server, and the establishment, from being penalized. What exactly the legal requirements are will vary by jurisdiction. In the US, this varies from state to state. Obviously, it will vary from country to country.
    – Makyen
    Jul 19 '17 at 4:04

















up vote
8
down vote













Below is what an Ethiopian passport looks like when you remove all personally identifiable information. As you can still see, all 3 dates (birth, passport issue and passport expiry) are using English language - and they're using the Gregorian calendar.



Ethiopian passport



When it comes to driving licenses - I found one in a blogpost:



Ethiopian driving license



It's not clear what calendar was used for the dates.



It will not be accepted for a several reasons:



  • It's using Amharic language written in Geez script. You can guess which label means "Date of birth" but your friendly bartender will not hazard a guess.

  • It's a simple piece of paper that will not be recognised as a driving license by most people in the USA. I know - I had an old-style Dutch paper driving license years ago and it took a lot of convincing before I could buy a beer in the USA - and this had Latin script on it.

In any case, it would never be legal to claim that your ID showed you were over the legal drinking age when in fact, you're not over the legal drinking age. The title of your question suggests that you want to know if it's legal - and then the answer is, "certainly not".



If you're asking, "will I get away with it" - then even then, probably not, as you won't be able to find an Ethiopian ID document that uses the Ethiopian calendar and uses Latin script plus a language that is understood by your alcoholic drinks seller in the USA.



Instead you will likely have all labels at least in Amharic with Geez script, and possibly the month names as well, if you were able to find one with dates in the Ethiopian calendar.






share|improve this answer
















  • 1




    I did some image searches which indicate that this is an old-style license, but your points will hold for the newer version, too. An international driving permit might increase the chance that an Ethiopian license would be accepted as proof of age, since it is essentially a certified translation, but I suppose it's still very unlikely.
    – phoog
    Jul 18 '17 at 16:48






  • 1




    You can guess which label means "Date of birth" but your friendly bartender will not hazard a guess. And if they do, they'll probably guess that the other two are issue date and expiry date. If they are on the Ethiopian calendar, they may believe it is expired, which may cause problems even for legal drinkers.
    – Random832
    Jul 19 '17 at 14:30

















up vote
6
down vote













In Europe I am sure...if your Pass/ID Card says you are born 1995 (and there is no reference to any sort of calendar), you will have no problems with drinking, smoking or whatever.



I am 99% sure that 99% in Europe have no idea, what you are talking about, so maybe you would need to explain them before, why they should (maybe) punish you :P






share|improve this answer
















  • 8




    While you would get away with this 99% of the time, you would not of course be legally allowed to drink.
    – DJClayworth
    Jul 18 '17 at 2:24






  • 5




    @DJClayworth Most EU countries allow drinking. Buying is different, but drinking? Yep, legal in most EU countries.
    – Olivier Grégoire
    Jul 18 '17 at 16:20










  • I agree with that.
    – DJClayworth
    Jul 18 '17 at 22:49

















up vote
4
down vote













It's pretty simple. If you're below the legal drinking age it's illegal. No matter what your ID appears to state. You may confuse people but that's all there is to it. And don't assume Europe is not as strict. You may not get challenged as often but there are strict official rules in all countries.






share|improve this answer
















  • 1




    OP isn't asking about people younger than 18 years old, but rather about people older with documents using different calendar which would suggest they are younger.
    – Kuba
    Jul 18 '17 at 19:41






  • 7




    Uhm, question implies that they are able to show they are older.
    – Paul Palmpje
    Jul 18 '17 at 19:44










  • Ah sorry, I read it the other way around.
    – Kuba
    Jul 18 '17 at 19:54

















up vote
3
down vote













This only applies if the drinking age is over 18



Ethiopian passports display the date of birth in Gregorian fashion in accordance with international rules, and are thus not of use.



Ethiopian driving licenses use the local calendar (source) but the legal age of driving in Ethiopia is 18 (see wikipedia) so this of no consequence unless the drinking age is above 18. Note, as well, that the expiry date of the license may be in the "past" if compared to the Gregorian year.



I am not aware of any other national ID available in Ethiopia.



And, in any case, the production of ID does not determine legality of drinking






share|improve this answer




















    Your Answer








    StackExchange.ready(function()
    var channelOptions =
    tags: "".split(" "),
    id: "273"
    ;
    initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);

    StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function()
    // Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
    if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled)
    StackExchange.using("snippets", function()
    createEditor();
    );

    else
    createEditor();

    );

    function createEditor()
    StackExchange.prepareEditor(
    heartbeatType: 'answer',
    convertImagesToLinks: false,
    noModals: true,
    showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
    reputationToPostImages: null,
    bindNavPrevention: true,
    postfix: "",
    imageUploader:
    brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
    contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"u003ecc by-sa 3.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
    allowUrls: true
    ,
    noCode: true, onDemand: true,
    discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
    ,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
    );



    );













    draft saved

    draft discarded


















    StackExchange.ready(
    function ()
    StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2ftravel.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f98306%2fcan-a-teenage-ethiopian-legally-drink-in-other-countries-using-their-id%23new-answer', 'question_page');

    );

    Post as a guest















    Required, but never shown

























    7 Answers
    7






    active

    oldest

    votes








    7 Answers
    7






    active

    oldest

    votes









    active

    oldest

    votes






    active

    oldest

    votes








    up vote
    24
    down vote













    According to ICAO 9303 Machine Readable Travel Documents:




    Dates in the VIZ of the MRTD shall be entered in accordance with the Gregorian calendar




    So if Ethiopian travel documents conform to ICAO standards (one would assume that they do, in order to be useful for international travel), Gregorian dates would appear at least in the machine readable section.



    Also mentioned in that document:




    The month may alternatively be printed in numerical form at the discretion of the issuing State or organization,
    particularly where this might facilitate the use of the MRTD by States using other than the Gregorian calendar. In this
    case the date would be written DDbMMbYY or DDbMMbYYYY, where b = a single blank space.




    I'm not quite sure how the use of numeric month names actually facilitates use of non-Gregorian calendars in practice.






    share|improve this answer




















    • Re: "I'm not quite sure how the use of numeric month names actually facilitates use of non-Gregorian calendars in practice": If I'm interpreting it right, the idea is that if a State doesn't use the Gregorian calendar, then it may have difficulty with the "printed in full in the national language [...] or abbreviated" option. (Quick: what's the English name for the third month of the Hebrew calendar?)
      – ruakh
      Jul 18 '17 at 5:42






    • 10




      @ruakh Which third month? ;)
      – Scimonster
      Jul 18 '17 at 8:43






    • 4




      This article indicates that Ethiopian driving licenses indeed use Gregorian dates. It's published in 2013 (surely Gregorian), and mentions pre-2008 licnenses, which again must be Gregorian, as Ethiopian 2008 was in the future in 2013.
      – ugoren
      Jul 18 '17 at 10:45














    up vote
    24
    down vote













    According to ICAO 9303 Machine Readable Travel Documents:




    Dates in the VIZ of the MRTD shall be entered in accordance with the Gregorian calendar




    So if Ethiopian travel documents conform to ICAO standards (one would assume that they do, in order to be useful for international travel), Gregorian dates would appear at least in the machine readable section.



    Also mentioned in that document:




    The month may alternatively be printed in numerical form at the discretion of the issuing State or organization,
    particularly where this might facilitate the use of the MRTD by States using other than the Gregorian calendar. In this
    case the date would be written DDbMMbYY or DDbMMbYYYY, where b = a single blank space.




    I'm not quite sure how the use of numeric month names actually facilitates use of non-Gregorian calendars in practice.






    share|improve this answer




















    • Re: "I'm not quite sure how the use of numeric month names actually facilitates use of non-Gregorian calendars in practice": If I'm interpreting it right, the idea is that if a State doesn't use the Gregorian calendar, then it may have difficulty with the "printed in full in the national language [...] or abbreviated" option. (Quick: what's the English name for the third month of the Hebrew calendar?)
      – ruakh
      Jul 18 '17 at 5:42






    • 10




      @ruakh Which third month? ;)
      – Scimonster
      Jul 18 '17 at 8:43






    • 4




      This article indicates that Ethiopian driving licenses indeed use Gregorian dates. It's published in 2013 (surely Gregorian), and mentions pre-2008 licnenses, which again must be Gregorian, as Ethiopian 2008 was in the future in 2013.
      – ugoren
      Jul 18 '17 at 10:45












    up vote
    24
    down vote










    up vote
    24
    down vote









    According to ICAO 9303 Machine Readable Travel Documents:




    Dates in the VIZ of the MRTD shall be entered in accordance with the Gregorian calendar




    So if Ethiopian travel documents conform to ICAO standards (one would assume that they do, in order to be useful for international travel), Gregorian dates would appear at least in the machine readable section.



    Also mentioned in that document:




    The month may alternatively be printed in numerical form at the discretion of the issuing State or organization,
    particularly where this might facilitate the use of the MRTD by States using other than the Gregorian calendar. In this
    case the date would be written DDbMMbYY or DDbMMbYYYY, where b = a single blank space.




    I'm not quite sure how the use of numeric month names actually facilitates use of non-Gregorian calendars in practice.






    share|improve this answer












    According to ICAO 9303 Machine Readable Travel Documents:




    Dates in the VIZ of the MRTD shall be entered in accordance with the Gregorian calendar




    So if Ethiopian travel documents conform to ICAO standards (one would assume that they do, in order to be useful for international travel), Gregorian dates would appear at least in the machine readable section.



    Also mentioned in that document:




    The month may alternatively be printed in numerical form at the discretion of the issuing State or organization,
    particularly where this might facilitate the use of the MRTD by States using other than the Gregorian calendar. In this
    case the date would be written DDbMMbYY or DDbMMbYYYY, where b = a single blank space.




    I'm not quite sure how the use of numeric month names actually facilitates use of non-Gregorian calendars in practice.







    share|improve this answer












    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer










    answered Jul 18 '17 at 2:57









    Greg Hewgill

    24.4k16494




    24.4k16494











    • Re: "I'm not quite sure how the use of numeric month names actually facilitates use of non-Gregorian calendars in practice": If I'm interpreting it right, the idea is that if a State doesn't use the Gregorian calendar, then it may have difficulty with the "printed in full in the national language [...] or abbreviated" option. (Quick: what's the English name for the third month of the Hebrew calendar?)
      – ruakh
      Jul 18 '17 at 5:42






    • 10




      @ruakh Which third month? ;)
      – Scimonster
      Jul 18 '17 at 8:43






    • 4




      This article indicates that Ethiopian driving licenses indeed use Gregorian dates. It's published in 2013 (surely Gregorian), and mentions pre-2008 licnenses, which again must be Gregorian, as Ethiopian 2008 was in the future in 2013.
      – ugoren
      Jul 18 '17 at 10:45
















    • Re: "I'm not quite sure how the use of numeric month names actually facilitates use of non-Gregorian calendars in practice": If I'm interpreting it right, the idea is that if a State doesn't use the Gregorian calendar, then it may have difficulty with the "printed in full in the national language [...] or abbreviated" option. (Quick: what's the English name for the third month of the Hebrew calendar?)
      – ruakh
      Jul 18 '17 at 5:42






    • 10




      @ruakh Which third month? ;)
      – Scimonster
      Jul 18 '17 at 8:43






    • 4




      This article indicates that Ethiopian driving licenses indeed use Gregorian dates. It's published in 2013 (surely Gregorian), and mentions pre-2008 licnenses, which again must be Gregorian, as Ethiopian 2008 was in the future in 2013.
      – ugoren
      Jul 18 '17 at 10:45















    Re: "I'm not quite sure how the use of numeric month names actually facilitates use of non-Gregorian calendars in practice": If I'm interpreting it right, the idea is that if a State doesn't use the Gregorian calendar, then it may have difficulty with the "printed in full in the national language [...] or abbreviated" option. (Quick: what's the English name for the third month of the Hebrew calendar?)
    – ruakh
    Jul 18 '17 at 5:42




    Re: "I'm not quite sure how the use of numeric month names actually facilitates use of non-Gregorian calendars in practice": If I'm interpreting it right, the idea is that if a State doesn't use the Gregorian calendar, then it may have difficulty with the "printed in full in the national language [...] or abbreviated" option. (Quick: what's the English name for the third month of the Hebrew calendar?)
    – ruakh
    Jul 18 '17 at 5:42




    10




    10




    @ruakh Which third month? ;)
    – Scimonster
    Jul 18 '17 at 8:43




    @ruakh Which third month? ;)
    – Scimonster
    Jul 18 '17 at 8:43




    4




    4




    This article indicates that Ethiopian driving licenses indeed use Gregorian dates. It's published in 2013 (surely Gregorian), and mentions pre-2008 licnenses, which again must be Gregorian, as Ethiopian 2008 was in the future in 2013.
    – ugoren
    Jul 18 '17 at 10:45




    This article indicates that Ethiopian driving licenses indeed use Gregorian dates. It's published in 2013 (surely Gregorian), and mentions pre-2008 licnenses, which again must be Gregorian, as Ethiopian 2008 was in the future in 2013.
    – ugoren
    Jul 18 '17 at 10:45












    up vote
    15
    down vote













    From a practical standpoint, a person using an Ethiopian passport in the USA might have trouble with people even recognizing it as a legal document, depending on where you go. A lot of Americans have never seen a passport and literally don't know what it is when presented with one. Most of the time people who aren't sure about what they are looking at will assume that if you are showing this document as proof of age it must be right, but it's possible that you will run into someone that refuses to serve you.



    I took my British husband to visit the US a few years ago, and we went to buy some beer at a public event in Pueblo, CO. The security person in charge of checking ID was adamant that he had to have a state-issued ID (that is, an American driver's license or ID card) even though he was obviously a foreign tourist and we were both clearly in our 30s. She didn't think his British passport was valid ID. I was eventually able to convince her by showing my US passport as comparison but it took some arguing.






    share|improve this answer
















    • 16




      That's kinda terrifying...
      – Mark Mayo
      Jul 18 '17 at 9:01






    • 13




      But a British passport is a state-issued ID. The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland is a state. It's just not a state of the USA.
      – Mike Scott
      Jul 18 '17 at 9:29










    • Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
      – JonathanReez
      Jul 19 '17 at 10:05






    • 3




      @MikeScott, that's a use of the word state that many Americans are not aware of.
      – The Photon
      Jul 19 '17 at 16:24






    • 2




      Keep in mind that state (US state, not nation-state) auditors are absurdly draconian when it comes to ID checks, so the bouncer may have been trained not to take documents if he hasn't personally seen a valid version of it. Obviously it would be better service to just say that and ask for your patience while he clears it with a manager, but bouncers aren't hired to be personable.
      – IllusiveBrian
      Jul 19 '17 at 18:37














    up vote
    15
    down vote













    From a practical standpoint, a person using an Ethiopian passport in the USA might have trouble with people even recognizing it as a legal document, depending on where you go. A lot of Americans have never seen a passport and literally don't know what it is when presented with one. Most of the time people who aren't sure about what they are looking at will assume that if you are showing this document as proof of age it must be right, but it's possible that you will run into someone that refuses to serve you.



    I took my British husband to visit the US a few years ago, and we went to buy some beer at a public event in Pueblo, CO. The security person in charge of checking ID was adamant that he had to have a state-issued ID (that is, an American driver's license or ID card) even though he was obviously a foreign tourist and we were both clearly in our 30s. She didn't think his British passport was valid ID. I was eventually able to convince her by showing my US passport as comparison but it took some arguing.






    share|improve this answer
















    • 16




      That's kinda terrifying...
      – Mark Mayo
      Jul 18 '17 at 9:01






    • 13




      But a British passport is a state-issued ID. The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland is a state. It's just not a state of the USA.
      – Mike Scott
      Jul 18 '17 at 9:29










    • Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
      – JonathanReez
      Jul 19 '17 at 10:05






    • 3




      @MikeScott, that's a use of the word state that many Americans are not aware of.
      – The Photon
      Jul 19 '17 at 16:24






    • 2




      Keep in mind that state (US state, not nation-state) auditors are absurdly draconian when it comes to ID checks, so the bouncer may have been trained not to take documents if he hasn't personally seen a valid version of it. Obviously it would be better service to just say that and ask for your patience while he clears it with a manager, but bouncers aren't hired to be personable.
      – IllusiveBrian
      Jul 19 '17 at 18:37












    up vote
    15
    down vote










    up vote
    15
    down vote









    From a practical standpoint, a person using an Ethiopian passport in the USA might have trouble with people even recognizing it as a legal document, depending on where you go. A lot of Americans have never seen a passport and literally don't know what it is when presented with one. Most of the time people who aren't sure about what they are looking at will assume that if you are showing this document as proof of age it must be right, but it's possible that you will run into someone that refuses to serve you.



    I took my British husband to visit the US a few years ago, and we went to buy some beer at a public event in Pueblo, CO. The security person in charge of checking ID was adamant that he had to have a state-issued ID (that is, an American driver's license or ID card) even though he was obviously a foreign tourist and we were both clearly in our 30s. She didn't think his British passport was valid ID. I was eventually able to convince her by showing my US passport as comparison but it took some arguing.






    share|improve this answer












    From a practical standpoint, a person using an Ethiopian passport in the USA might have trouble with people even recognizing it as a legal document, depending on where you go. A lot of Americans have never seen a passport and literally don't know what it is when presented with one. Most of the time people who aren't sure about what they are looking at will assume that if you are showing this document as proof of age it must be right, but it's possible that you will run into someone that refuses to serve you.



    I took my British husband to visit the US a few years ago, and we went to buy some beer at a public event in Pueblo, CO. The security person in charge of checking ID was adamant that he had to have a state-issued ID (that is, an American driver's license or ID card) even though he was obviously a foreign tourist and we were both clearly in our 30s. She didn't think his British passport was valid ID. I was eventually able to convince her by showing my US passport as comparison but it took some arguing.







    share|improve this answer












    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer










    answered Jul 18 '17 at 9:00









    manderw

    1712




    1712







    • 16




      That's kinda terrifying...
      – Mark Mayo
      Jul 18 '17 at 9:01






    • 13




      But a British passport is a state-issued ID. The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland is a state. It's just not a state of the USA.
      – Mike Scott
      Jul 18 '17 at 9:29










    • Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
      – JonathanReez
      Jul 19 '17 at 10:05






    • 3




      @MikeScott, that's a use of the word state that many Americans are not aware of.
      – The Photon
      Jul 19 '17 at 16:24






    • 2




      Keep in mind that state (US state, not nation-state) auditors are absurdly draconian when it comes to ID checks, so the bouncer may have been trained not to take documents if he hasn't personally seen a valid version of it. Obviously it would be better service to just say that and ask for your patience while he clears it with a manager, but bouncers aren't hired to be personable.
      – IllusiveBrian
      Jul 19 '17 at 18:37












    • 16




      That's kinda terrifying...
      – Mark Mayo
      Jul 18 '17 at 9:01






    • 13




      But a British passport is a state-issued ID. The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland is a state. It's just not a state of the USA.
      – Mike Scott
      Jul 18 '17 at 9:29










    • Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
      – JonathanReez
      Jul 19 '17 at 10:05






    • 3




      @MikeScott, that's a use of the word state that many Americans are not aware of.
      – The Photon
      Jul 19 '17 at 16:24






    • 2




      Keep in mind that state (US state, not nation-state) auditors are absurdly draconian when it comes to ID checks, so the bouncer may have been trained not to take documents if he hasn't personally seen a valid version of it. Obviously it would be better service to just say that and ask for your patience while he clears it with a manager, but bouncers aren't hired to be personable.
      – IllusiveBrian
      Jul 19 '17 at 18:37







    16




    16




    That's kinda terrifying...
    – Mark Mayo
    Jul 18 '17 at 9:01




    That's kinda terrifying...
    – Mark Mayo
    Jul 18 '17 at 9:01




    13




    13




    But a British passport is a state-issued ID. The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland is a state. It's just not a state of the USA.
    – Mike Scott
    Jul 18 '17 at 9:29




    But a British passport is a state-issued ID. The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland is a state. It's just not a state of the USA.
    – Mike Scott
    Jul 18 '17 at 9:29












    Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
    – JonathanReez
    Jul 19 '17 at 10:05




    Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
    – JonathanReez
    Jul 19 '17 at 10:05




    3




    3




    @MikeScott, that's a use of the word state that many Americans are not aware of.
    – The Photon
    Jul 19 '17 at 16:24




    @MikeScott, that's a use of the word state that many Americans are not aware of.
    – The Photon
    Jul 19 '17 at 16:24




    2




    2




    Keep in mind that state (US state, not nation-state) auditors are absurdly draconian when it comes to ID checks, so the bouncer may have been trained not to take documents if he hasn't personally seen a valid version of it. Obviously it would be better service to just say that and ask for your patience while he clears it with a manager, but bouncers aren't hired to be personable.
    – IllusiveBrian
    Jul 19 '17 at 18:37




    Keep in mind that state (US state, not nation-state) auditors are absurdly draconian when it comes to ID checks, so the bouncer may have been trained not to take documents if he hasn't personally seen a valid version of it. Obviously it would be better service to just say that and ask for your patience while he clears it with a manager, but bouncers aren't hired to be personable.
    – IllusiveBrian
    Jul 19 '17 at 18:37










    up vote
    12
    down vote













    Of course you cannot legally drink if you are too young. What counts is your age, not a number printed in your passport.



    In practice, if you are 17 years old and 18 is required, the number in your passport will falsely indicate that you are 25. Most people will not know about Ethiopian passports and will not know how to identify them. If your passport seems to say "25" and your real age is 17, they will take one look at you and conclude that the passport is a forgery. Which is wrong, but you won't be served alcohol.



    You will also have trouble getting alcohol if you are old enough (say 18), and your passport looks like saying you are 26. Again they will assume that the passport is forged and not serve you alcohol, because you don't look like you might be 26.



    In many countries, there are severe consequences for someone being caught selling alcohol to someone below the legal age, so nobody will be willing to take the slightest risk. No sane person will sell alcohol to someone who doesn't look 18 and has a passport showing an age of 25, if selling to a minor and getting caught means losing your job, a major fine for the store or bar, and possibly loss of license. In addition with a passport where they have no idea how to check whether it is genuine or not.



    @Josef: When you sell alcohol, it's not your job to guess the buyers age correctly. Your job is to make 100% sure that you don't sell to anyone under the legal age. For example, in the UK: "A person commits an offence under section 146 if he sells alcohol to a child under 18." It's a defence if no reasonable person could have thought that that the person is under 18. If you can't guess the buyers age correctly, you can't sell. Punished with a fine up to £5,000.



    And there are no exceptions for black kids because you don't want to look racist. Since the whole reason for the rules is that it's dangerous for kids to consume alcohol, I'd say that selling to black kids and not to white ones is racist, not the other way round. You can tell in court "I sold alcohol to these 17 year old kids because they were black and I didn't want to appear racist". The court will say "So you knew they were under 18 and still sold them alcohol. Ok, that's a £5,000 fine. Next time check their age and not their colour. That's because black kids need to be protected just as much as white kids".






    share|improve this answer


















    • 7




      If your passport seems to say "25" and your real age is 17, they will take one look at you and conclude that the passport is a forgery. I doubt so, maybe sometimes, but this implication is not true. Most of the time they will not bother, they were presented an ID and they are covered. Besides, 20 years ago we were drinking underage all the time but that might have changed.
      – Vladimir F
      Jul 18 '17 at 8:35






    • 9




      Also most people from Ethiopia propably don't look caucasian which would 1. make it harder for people mostly surrounded by caucasians to guess their age correctly and 2. people would probably afraid to say anything even if they assumed the person looks too young because it could look like racism.
      – Josef
      Jul 18 '17 at 8:44






    • 2




      Note to the changed answer: Right, it is not the job of the sales person to guess the age correctly. That's exactly my point. They get shown a passport which says the person is born 1998. They sell alcohol. End of story. Almost no one will start with "well, the passport says she is 19 but to me she looks more like 16, I should not sell". The job is to sell stuff. The law says, check that the buyer is >=18. The passport says, she is. End of story! Especially if the sales person has not much experience with estimating the age of non-caucasian people.
      – Josef
      Jul 18 '17 at 12:31











    • @Josef. As a good example of that, my brother-in-law never got carded when he was under age, but my best friend still does sometimes, despite being in his early thirties now. They are both Ethiopian. To be fair, the former was over 6' tall with a goatee since he was 16, the latter still has a baby face, so I would not call it racism in this case.
      – Mad Physicist
      Jul 18 '17 at 15:15










    • @VladimirF, In some jurisdictions, when selling alcohol, it is the legal responsibility of the person checking the ID to identify IDs that are forgeries (regardless of the fact that detecting a forgery might very difficult). Thus, in many situations just that you asked for ID, looked at it and it stated they were over the legal age is not sufficient to prevent the checker/server, and the establishment, from being penalized. What exactly the legal requirements are will vary by jurisdiction. In the US, this varies from state to state. Obviously, it will vary from country to country.
      – Makyen
      Jul 19 '17 at 4:04














    up vote
    12
    down vote













    Of course you cannot legally drink if you are too young. What counts is your age, not a number printed in your passport.



    In practice, if you are 17 years old and 18 is required, the number in your passport will falsely indicate that you are 25. Most people will not know about Ethiopian passports and will not know how to identify them. If your passport seems to say "25" and your real age is 17, they will take one look at you and conclude that the passport is a forgery. Which is wrong, but you won't be served alcohol.



    You will also have trouble getting alcohol if you are old enough (say 18), and your passport looks like saying you are 26. Again they will assume that the passport is forged and not serve you alcohol, because you don't look like you might be 26.



    In many countries, there are severe consequences for someone being caught selling alcohol to someone below the legal age, so nobody will be willing to take the slightest risk. No sane person will sell alcohol to someone who doesn't look 18 and has a passport showing an age of 25, if selling to a minor and getting caught means losing your job, a major fine for the store or bar, and possibly loss of license. In addition with a passport where they have no idea how to check whether it is genuine or not.



    @Josef: When you sell alcohol, it's not your job to guess the buyers age correctly. Your job is to make 100% sure that you don't sell to anyone under the legal age. For example, in the UK: "A person commits an offence under section 146 if he sells alcohol to a child under 18." It's a defence if no reasonable person could have thought that that the person is under 18. If you can't guess the buyers age correctly, you can't sell. Punished with a fine up to £5,000.



    And there are no exceptions for black kids because you don't want to look racist. Since the whole reason for the rules is that it's dangerous for kids to consume alcohol, I'd say that selling to black kids and not to white ones is racist, not the other way round. You can tell in court "I sold alcohol to these 17 year old kids because they were black and I didn't want to appear racist". The court will say "So you knew they were under 18 and still sold them alcohol. Ok, that's a £5,000 fine. Next time check their age and not their colour. That's because black kids need to be protected just as much as white kids".






    share|improve this answer


















    • 7




      If your passport seems to say "25" and your real age is 17, they will take one look at you and conclude that the passport is a forgery. I doubt so, maybe sometimes, but this implication is not true. Most of the time they will not bother, they were presented an ID and they are covered. Besides, 20 years ago we were drinking underage all the time but that might have changed.
      – Vladimir F
      Jul 18 '17 at 8:35






    • 9




      Also most people from Ethiopia propably don't look caucasian which would 1. make it harder for people mostly surrounded by caucasians to guess their age correctly and 2. people would probably afraid to say anything even if they assumed the person looks too young because it could look like racism.
      – Josef
      Jul 18 '17 at 8:44






    • 2




      Note to the changed answer: Right, it is not the job of the sales person to guess the age correctly. That's exactly my point. They get shown a passport which says the person is born 1998. They sell alcohol. End of story. Almost no one will start with "well, the passport says she is 19 but to me she looks more like 16, I should not sell". The job is to sell stuff. The law says, check that the buyer is >=18. The passport says, she is. End of story! Especially if the sales person has not much experience with estimating the age of non-caucasian people.
      – Josef
      Jul 18 '17 at 12:31











    • @Josef. As a good example of that, my brother-in-law never got carded when he was under age, but my best friend still does sometimes, despite being in his early thirties now. They are both Ethiopian. To be fair, the former was over 6' tall with a goatee since he was 16, the latter still has a baby face, so I would not call it racism in this case.
      – Mad Physicist
      Jul 18 '17 at 15:15










    • @VladimirF, In some jurisdictions, when selling alcohol, it is the legal responsibility of the person checking the ID to identify IDs that are forgeries (regardless of the fact that detecting a forgery might very difficult). Thus, in many situations just that you asked for ID, looked at it and it stated they were over the legal age is not sufficient to prevent the checker/server, and the establishment, from being penalized. What exactly the legal requirements are will vary by jurisdiction. In the US, this varies from state to state. Obviously, it will vary from country to country.
      – Makyen
      Jul 19 '17 at 4:04












    up vote
    12
    down vote










    up vote
    12
    down vote









    Of course you cannot legally drink if you are too young. What counts is your age, not a number printed in your passport.



    In practice, if you are 17 years old and 18 is required, the number in your passport will falsely indicate that you are 25. Most people will not know about Ethiopian passports and will not know how to identify them. If your passport seems to say "25" and your real age is 17, they will take one look at you and conclude that the passport is a forgery. Which is wrong, but you won't be served alcohol.



    You will also have trouble getting alcohol if you are old enough (say 18), and your passport looks like saying you are 26. Again they will assume that the passport is forged and not serve you alcohol, because you don't look like you might be 26.



    In many countries, there are severe consequences for someone being caught selling alcohol to someone below the legal age, so nobody will be willing to take the slightest risk. No sane person will sell alcohol to someone who doesn't look 18 and has a passport showing an age of 25, if selling to a minor and getting caught means losing your job, a major fine for the store or bar, and possibly loss of license. In addition with a passport where they have no idea how to check whether it is genuine or not.



    @Josef: When you sell alcohol, it's not your job to guess the buyers age correctly. Your job is to make 100% sure that you don't sell to anyone under the legal age. For example, in the UK: "A person commits an offence under section 146 if he sells alcohol to a child under 18." It's a defence if no reasonable person could have thought that that the person is under 18. If you can't guess the buyers age correctly, you can't sell. Punished with a fine up to £5,000.



    And there are no exceptions for black kids because you don't want to look racist. Since the whole reason for the rules is that it's dangerous for kids to consume alcohol, I'd say that selling to black kids and not to white ones is racist, not the other way round. You can tell in court "I sold alcohol to these 17 year old kids because they were black and I didn't want to appear racist". The court will say "So you knew they were under 18 and still sold them alcohol. Ok, that's a £5,000 fine. Next time check their age and not their colour. That's because black kids need to be protected just as much as white kids".






    share|improve this answer














    Of course you cannot legally drink if you are too young. What counts is your age, not a number printed in your passport.



    In practice, if you are 17 years old and 18 is required, the number in your passport will falsely indicate that you are 25. Most people will not know about Ethiopian passports and will not know how to identify them. If your passport seems to say "25" and your real age is 17, they will take one look at you and conclude that the passport is a forgery. Which is wrong, but you won't be served alcohol.



    You will also have trouble getting alcohol if you are old enough (say 18), and your passport looks like saying you are 26. Again they will assume that the passport is forged and not serve you alcohol, because you don't look like you might be 26.



    In many countries, there are severe consequences for someone being caught selling alcohol to someone below the legal age, so nobody will be willing to take the slightest risk. No sane person will sell alcohol to someone who doesn't look 18 and has a passport showing an age of 25, if selling to a minor and getting caught means losing your job, a major fine for the store or bar, and possibly loss of license. In addition with a passport where they have no idea how to check whether it is genuine or not.



    @Josef: When you sell alcohol, it's not your job to guess the buyers age correctly. Your job is to make 100% sure that you don't sell to anyone under the legal age. For example, in the UK: "A person commits an offence under section 146 if he sells alcohol to a child under 18." It's a defence if no reasonable person could have thought that that the person is under 18. If you can't guess the buyers age correctly, you can't sell. Punished with a fine up to £5,000.



    And there are no exceptions for black kids because you don't want to look racist. Since the whole reason for the rules is that it's dangerous for kids to consume alcohol, I'd say that selling to black kids and not to white ones is racist, not the other way round. You can tell in court "I sold alcohol to these 17 year old kids because they were black and I didn't want to appear racist". The court will say "So you knew they were under 18 and still sold them alcohol. Ok, that's a £5,000 fine. Next time check their age and not their colour. That's because black kids need to be protected just as much as white kids".







    share|improve this answer














    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer








    edited Jul 18 '17 at 9:13

























    answered Jul 18 '17 at 8:03









    gnasher729

    2,373816




    2,373816







    • 7




      If your passport seems to say "25" and your real age is 17, they will take one look at you and conclude that the passport is a forgery. I doubt so, maybe sometimes, but this implication is not true. Most of the time they will not bother, they were presented an ID and they are covered. Besides, 20 years ago we were drinking underage all the time but that might have changed.
      – Vladimir F
      Jul 18 '17 at 8:35






    • 9




      Also most people from Ethiopia propably don't look caucasian which would 1. make it harder for people mostly surrounded by caucasians to guess their age correctly and 2. people would probably afraid to say anything even if they assumed the person looks too young because it could look like racism.
      – Josef
      Jul 18 '17 at 8:44






    • 2




      Note to the changed answer: Right, it is not the job of the sales person to guess the age correctly. That's exactly my point. They get shown a passport which says the person is born 1998. They sell alcohol. End of story. Almost no one will start with "well, the passport says she is 19 but to me she looks more like 16, I should not sell". The job is to sell stuff. The law says, check that the buyer is >=18. The passport says, she is. End of story! Especially if the sales person has not much experience with estimating the age of non-caucasian people.
      – Josef
      Jul 18 '17 at 12:31











    • @Josef. As a good example of that, my brother-in-law never got carded when he was under age, but my best friend still does sometimes, despite being in his early thirties now. They are both Ethiopian. To be fair, the former was over 6' tall with a goatee since he was 16, the latter still has a baby face, so I would not call it racism in this case.
      – Mad Physicist
      Jul 18 '17 at 15:15










    • @VladimirF, In some jurisdictions, when selling alcohol, it is the legal responsibility of the person checking the ID to identify IDs that are forgeries (regardless of the fact that detecting a forgery might very difficult). Thus, in many situations just that you asked for ID, looked at it and it stated they were over the legal age is not sufficient to prevent the checker/server, and the establishment, from being penalized. What exactly the legal requirements are will vary by jurisdiction. In the US, this varies from state to state. Obviously, it will vary from country to country.
      – Makyen
      Jul 19 '17 at 4:04












    • 7




      If your passport seems to say "25" and your real age is 17, they will take one look at you and conclude that the passport is a forgery. I doubt so, maybe sometimes, but this implication is not true. Most of the time they will not bother, they were presented an ID and they are covered. Besides, 20 years ago we were drinking underage all the time but that might have changed.
      – Vladimir F
      Jul 18 '17 at 8:35






    • 9




      Also most people from Ethiopia propably don't look caucasian which would 1. make it harder for people mostly surrounded by caucasians to guess their age correctly and 2. people would probably afraid to say anything even if they assumed the person looks too young because it could look like racism.
      – Josef
      Jul 18 '17 at 8:44






    • 2




      Note to the changed answer: Right, it is not the job of the sales person to guess the age correctly. That's exactly my point. They get shown a passport which says the person is born 1998. They sell alcohol. End of story. Almost no one will start with "well, the passport says she is 19 but to me she looks more like 16, I should not sell". The job is to sell stuff. The law says, check that the buyer is >=18. The passport says, she is. End of story! Especially if the sales person has not much experience with estimating the age of non-caucasian people.
      – Josef
      Jul 18 '17 at 12:31











    • @Josef. As a good example of that, my brother-in-law never got carded when he was under age, but my best friend still does sometimes, despite being in his early thirties now. They are both Ethiopian. To be fair, the former was over 6' tall with a goatee since he was 16, the latter still has a baby face, so I would not call it racism in this case.
      – Mad Physicist
      Jul 18 '17 at 15:15










    • @VladimirF, In some jurisdictions, when selling alcohol, it is the legal responsibility of the person checking the ID to identify IDs that are forgeries (regardless of the fact that detecting a forgery might very difficult). Thus, in many situations just that you asked for ID, looked at it and it stated they were over the legal age is not sufficient to prevent the checker/server, and the establishment, from being penalized. What exactly the legal requirements are will vary by jurisdiction. In the US, this varies from state to state. Obviously, it will vary from country to country.
      – Makyen
      Jul 19 '17 at 4:04







    7




    7




    If your passport seems to say "25" and your real age is 17, they will take one look at you and conclude that the passport is a forgery. I doubt so, maybe sometimes, but this implication is not true. Most of the time they will not bother, they were presented an ID and they are covered. Besides, 20 years ago we were drinking underage all the time but that might have changed.
    – Vladimir F
    Jul 18 '17 at 8:35




    If your passport seems to say "25" and your real age is 17, they will take one look at you and conclude that the passport is a forgery. I doubt so, maybe sometimes, but this implication is not true. Most of the time they will not bother, they were presented an ID and they are covered. Besides, 20 years ago we were drinking underage all the time but that might have changed.
    – Vladimir F
    Jul 18 '17 at 8:35




    9




    9




    Also most people from Ethiopia propably don't look caucasian which would 1. make it harder for people mostly surrounded by caucasians to guess their age correctly and 2. people would probably afraid to say anything even if they assumed the person looks too young because it could look like racism.
    – Josef
    Jul 18 '17 at 8:44




    Also most people from Ethiopia propably don't look caucasian which would 1. make it harder for people mostly surrounded by caucasians to guess their age correctly and 2. people would probably afraid to say anything even if they assumed the person looks too young because it could look like racism.
    – Josef
    Jul 18 '17 at 8:44




    2




    2




    Note to the changed answer: Right, it is not the job of the sales person to guess the age correctly. That's exactly my point. They get shown a passport which says the person is born 1998. They sell alcohol. End of story. Almost no one will start with "well, the passport says she is 19 but to me she looks more like 16, I should not sell". The job is to sell stuff. The law says, check that the buyer is >=18. The passport says, she is. End of story! Especially if the sales person has not much experience with estimating the age of non-caucasian people.
    – Josef
    Jul 18 '17 at 12:31





    Note to the changed answer: Right, it is not the job of the sales person to guess the age correctly. That's exactly my point. They get shown a passport which says the person is born 1998. They sell alcohol. End of story. Almost no one will start with "well, the passport says she is 19 but to me she looks more like 16, I should not sell". The job is to sell stuff. The law says, check that the buyer is >=18. The passport says, she is. End of story! Especially if the sales person has not much experience with estimating the age of non-caucasian people.
    – Josef
    Jul 18 '17 at 12:31













    @Josef. As a good example of that, my brother-in-law never got carded when he was under age, but my best friend still does sometimes, despite being in his early thirties now. They are both Ethiopian. To be fair, the former was over 6' tall with a goatee since he was 16, the latter still has a baby face, so I would not call it racism in this case.
    – Mad Physicist
    Jul 18 '17 at 15:15




    @Josef. As a good example of that, my brother-in-law never got carded when he was under age, but my best friend still does sometimes, despite being in his early thirties now. They are both Ethiopian. To be fair, the former was over 6' tall with a goatee since he was 16, the latter still has a baby face, so I would not call it racism in this case.
    – Mad Physicist
    Jul 18 '17 at 15:15












    @VladimirF, In some jurisdictions, when selling alcohol, it is the legal responsibility of the person checking the ID to identify IDs that are forgeries (regardless of the fact that detecting a forgery might very difficult). Thus, in many situations just that you asked for ID, looked at it and it stated they were over the legal age is not sufficient to prevent the checker/server, and the establishment, from being penalized. What exactly the legal requirements are will vary by jurisdiction. In the US, this varies from state to state. Obviously, it will vary from country to country.
    – Makyen
    Jul 19 '17 at 4:04




    @VladimirF, In some jurisdictions, when selling alcohol, it is the legal responsibility of the person checking the ID to identify IDs that are forgeries (regardless of the fact that detecting a forgery might very difficult). Thus, in many situations just that you asked for ID, looked at it and it stated they were over the legal age is not sufficient to prevent the checker/server, and the establishment, from being penalized. What exactly the legal requirements are will vary by jurisdiction. In the US, this varies from state to state. Obviously, it will vary from country to country.
    – Makyen
    Jul 19 '17 at 4:04










    up vote
    8
    down vote













    Below is what an Ethiopian passport looks like when you remove all personally identifiable information. As you can still see, all 3 dates (birth, passport issue and passport expiry) are using English language - and they're using the Gregorian calendar.



    Ethiopian passport



    When it comes to driving licenses - I found one in a blogpost:



    Ethiopian driving license



    It's not clear what calendar was used for the dates.



    It will not be accepted for a several reasons:



    • It's using Amharic language written in Geez script. You can guess which label means "Date of birth" but your friendly bartender will not hazard a guess.

    • It's a simple piece of paper that will not be recognised as a driving license by most people in the USA. I know - I had an old-style Dutch paper driving license years ago and it took a lot of convincing before I could buy a beer in the USA - and this had Latin script on it.

    In any case, it would never be legal to claim that your ID showed you were over the legal drinking age when in fact, you're not over the legal drinking age. The title of your question suggests that you want to know if it's legal - and then the answer is, "certainly not".



    If you're asking, "will I get away with it" - then even then, probably not, as you won't be able to find an Ethiopian ID document that uses the Ethiopian calendar and uses Latin script plus a language that is understood by your alcoholic drinks seller in the USA.



    Instead you will likely have all labels at least in Amharic with Geez script, and possibly the month names as well, if you were able to find one with dates in the Ethiopian calendar.






    share|improve this answer
















    • 1




      I did some image searches which indicate that this is an old-style license, but your points will hold for the newer version, too. An international driving permit might increase the chance that an Ethiopian license would be accepted as proof of age, since it is essentially a certified translation, but I suppose it's still very unlikely.
      – phoog
      Jul 18 '17 at 16:48






    • 1




      You can guess which label means "Date of birth" but your friendly bartender will not hazard a guess. And if they do, they'll probably guess that the other two are issue date and expiry date. If they are on the Ethiopian calendar, they may believe it is expired, which may cause problems even for legal drinkers.
      – Random832
      Jul 19 '17 at 14:30














    up vote
    8
    down vote













    Below is what an Ethiopian passport looks like when you remove all personally identifiable information. As you can still see, all 3 dates (birth, passport issue and passport expiry) are using English language - and they're using the Gregorian calendar.



    Ethiopian passport



    When it comes to driving licenses - I found one in a blogpost:



    Ethiopian driving license



    It's not clear what calendar was used for the dates.



    It will not be accepted for a several reasons:



    • It's using Amharic language written in Geez script. You can guess which label means "Date of birth" but your friendly bartender will not hazard a guess.

    • It's a simple piece of paper that will not be recognised as a driving license by most people in the USA. I know - I had an old-style Dutch paper driving license years ago and it took a lot of convincing before I could buy a beer in the USA - and this had Latin script on it.

    In any case, it would never be legal to claim that your ID showed you were over the legal drinking age when in fact, you're not over the legal drinking age. The title of your question suggests that you want to know if it's legal - and then the answer is, "certainly not".



    If you're asking, "will I get away with it" - then even then, probably not, as you won't be able to find an Ethiopian ID document that uses the Ethiopian calendar and uses Latin script plus a language that is understood by your alcoholic drinks seller in the USA.



    Instead you will likely have all labels at least in Amharic with Geez script, and possibly the month names as well, if you were able to find one with dates in the Ethiopian calendar.






    share|improve this answer
















    • 1




      I did some image searches which indicate that this is an old-style license, but your points will hold for the newer version, too. An international driving permit might increase the chance that an Ethiopian license would be accepted as proof of age, since it is essentially a certified translation, but I suppose it's still very unlikely.
      – phoog
      Jul 18 '17 at 16:48






    • 1




      You can guess which label means "Date of birth" but your friendly bartender will not hazard a guess. And if they do, they'll probably guess that the other two are issue date and expiry date. If they are on the Ethiopian calendar, they may believe it is expired, which may cause problems even for legal drinkers.
      – Random832
      Jul 19 '17 at 14:30












    up vote
    8
    down vote










    up vote
    8
    down vote









    Below is what an Ethiopian passport looks like when you remove all personally identifiable information. As you can still see, all 3 dates (birth, passport issue and passport expiry) are using English language - and they're using the Gregorian calendar.



    Ethiopian passport



    When it comes to driving licenses - I found one in a blogpost:



    Ethiopian driving license



    It's not clear what calendar was used for the dates.



    It will not be accepted for a several reasons:



    • It's using Amharic language written in Geez script. You can guess which label means "Date of birth" but your friendly bartender will not hazard a guess.

    • It's a simple piece of paper that will not be recognised as a driving license by most people in the USA. I know - I had an old-style Dutch paper driving license years ago and it took a lot of convincing before I could buy a beer in the USA - and this had Latin script on it.

    In any case, it would never be legal to claim that your ID showed you were over the legal drinking age when in fact, you're not over the legal drinking age. The title of your question suggests that you want to know if it's legal - and then the answer is, "certainly not".



    If you're asking, "will I get away with it" - then even then, probably not, as you won't be able to find an Ethiopian ID document that uses the Ethiopian calendar and uses Latin script plus a language that is understood by your alcoholic drinks seller in the USA.



    Instead you will likely have all labels at least in Amharic with Geez script, and possibly the month names as well, if you were able to find one with dates in the Ethiopian calendar.






    share|improve this answer












    Below is what an Ethiopian passport looks like when you remove all personally identifiable information. As you can still see, all 3 dates (birth, passport issue and passport expiry) are using English language - and they're using the Gregorian calendar.



    Ethiopian passport



    When it comes to driving licenses - I found one in a blogpost:



    Ethiopian driving license



    It's not clear what calendar was used for the dates.



    It will not be accepted for a several reasons:



    • It's using Amharic language written in Geez script. You can guess which label means "Date of birth" but your friendly bartender will not hazard a guess.

    • It's a simple piece of paper that will not be recognised as a driving license by most people in the USA. I know - I had an old-style Dutch paper driving license years ago and it took a lot of convincing before I could buy a beer in the USA - and this had Latin script on it.

    In any case, it would never be legal to claim that your ID showed you were over the legal drinking age when in fact, you're not over the legal drinking age. The title of your question suggests that you want to know if it's legal - and then the answer is, "certainly not".



    If you're asking, "will I get away with it" - then even then, probably not, as you won't be able to find an Ethiopian ID document that uses the Ethiopian calendar and uses Latin script plus a language that is understood by your alcoholic drinks seller in the USA.



    Instead you will likely have all labels at least in Amharic with Geez script, and possibly the month names as well, if you were able to find one with dates in the Ethiopian calendar.







    share|improve this answer












    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer










    answered Jul 18 '17 at 15:44









    Erwin Bolwidt

    1767




    1767







    • 1




      I did some image searches which indicate that this is an old-style license, but your points will hold for the newer version, too. An international driving permit might increase the chance that an Ethiopian license would be accepted as proof of age, since it is essentially a certified translation, but I suppose it's still very unlikely.
      – phoog
      Jul 18 '17 at 16:48






    • 1




      You can guess which label means "Date of birth" but your friendly bartender will not hazard a guess. And if they do, they'll probably guess that the other two are issue date and expiry date. If they are on the Ethiopian calendar, they may believe it is expired, which may cause problems even for legal drinkers.
      – Random832
      Jul 19 '17 at 14:30












    • 1




      I did some image searches which indicate that this is an old-style license, but your points will hold for the newer version, too. An international driving permit might increase the chance that an Ethiopian license would be accepted as proof of age, since it is essentially a certified translation, but I suppose it's still very unlikely.
      – phoog
      Jul 18 '17 at 16:48






    • 1




      You can guess which label means "Date of birth" but your friendly bartender will not hazard a guess. And if they do, they'll probably guess that the other two are issue date and expiry date. If they are on the Ethiopian calendar, they may believe it is expired, which may cause problems even for legal drinkers.
      – Random832
      Jul 19 '17 at 14:30







    1




    1




    I did some image searches which indicate that this is an old-style license, but your points will hold for the newer version, too. An international driving permit might increase the chance that an Ethiopian license would be accepted as proof of age, since it is essentially a certified translation, but I suppose it's still very unlikely.
    – phoog
    Jul 18 '17 at 16:48




    I did some image searches which indicate that this is an old-style license, but your points will hold for the newer version, too. An international driving permit might increase the chance that an Ethiopian license would be accepted as proof of age, since it is essentially a certified translation, but I suppose it's still very unlikely.
    – phoog
    Jul 18 '17 at 16:48




    1




    1




    You can guess which label means "Date of birth" but your friendly bartender will not hazard a guess. And if they do, they'll probably guess that the other two are issue date and expiry date. If they are on the Ethiopian calendar, they may believe it is expired, which may cause problems even for legal drinkers.
    – Random832
    Jul 19 '17 at 14:30




    You can guess which label means "Date of birth" but your friendly bartender will not hazard a guess. And if they do, they'll probably guess that the other two are issue date and expiry date. If they are on the Ethiopian calendar, they may believe it is expired, which may cause problems even for legal drinkers.
    – Random832
    Jul 19 '17 at 14:30










    up vote
    6
    down vote













    In Europe I am sure...if your Pass/ID Card says you are born 1995 (and there is no reference to any sort of calendar), you will have no problems with drinking, smoking or whatever.



    I am 99% sure that 99% in Europe have no idea, what you are talking about, so maybe you would need to explain them before, why they should (maybe) punish you :P






    share|improve this answer
















    • 8




      While you would get away with this 99% of the time, you would not of course be legally allowed to drink.
      – DJClayworth
      Jul 18 '17 at 2:24






    • 5




      @DJClayworth Most EU countries allow drinking. Buying is different, but drinking? Yep, legal in most EU countries.
      – Olivier Grégoire
      Jul 18 '17 at 16:20










    • I agree with that.
      – DJClayworth
      Jul 18 '17 at 22:49














    up vote
    6
    down vote













    In Europe I am sure...if your Pass/ID Card says you are born 1995 (and there is no reference to any sort of calendar), you will have no problems with drinking, smoking or whatever.



    I am 99% sure that 99% in Europe have no idea, what you are talking about, so maybe you would need to explain them before, why they should (maybe) punish you :P






    share|improve this answer
















    • 8




      While you would get away with this 99% of the time, you would not of course be legally allowed to drink.
      – DJClayworth
      Jul 18 '17 at 2:24






    • 5




      @DJClayworth Most EU countries allow drinking. Buying is different, but drinking? Yep, legal in most EU countries.
      – Olivier Grégoire
      Jul 18 '17 at 16:20










    • I agree with that.
      – DJClayworth
      Jul 18 '17 at 22:49












    up vote
    6
    down vote










    up vote
    6
    down vote









    In Europe I am sure...if your Pass/ID Card says you are born 1995 (and there is no reference to any sort of calendar), you will have no problems with drinking, smoking or whatever.



    I am 99% sure that 99% in Europe have no idea, what you are talking about, so maybe you would need to explain them before, why they should (maybe) punish you :P






    share|improve this answer












    In Europe I am sure...if your Pass/ID Card says you are born 1995 (and there is no reference to any sort of calendar), you will have no problems with drinking, smoking or whatever.



    I am 99% sure that 99% in Europe have no idea, what you are talking about, so maybe you would need to explain them before, why they should (maybe) punish you :P







    share|improve this answer












    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer










    answered Jul 18 '17 at 2:16









    R. Gomez

    29513




    29513







    • 8




      While you would get away with this 99% of the time, you would not of course be legally allowed to drink.
      – DJClayworth
      Jul 18 '17 at 2:24






    • 5




      @DJClayworth Most EU countries allow drinking. Buying is different, but drinking? Yep, legal in most EU countries.
      – Olivier Grégoire
      Jul 18 '17 at 16:20










    • I agree with that.
      – DJClayworth
      Jul 18 '17 at 22:49












    • 8




      While you would get away with this 99% of the time, you would not of course be legally allowed to drink.
      – DJClayworth
      Jul 18 '17 at 2:24






    • 5




      @DJClayworth Most EU countries allow drinking. Buying is different, but drinking? Yep, legal in most EU countries.
      – Olivier Grégoire
      Jul 18 '17 at 16:20










    • I agree with that.
      – DJClayworth
      Jul 18 '17 at 22:49







    8




    8




    While you would get away with this 99% of the time, you would not of course be legally allowed to drink.
    – DJClayworth
    Jul 18 '17 at 2:24




    While you would get away with this 99% of the time, you would not of course be legally allowed to drink.
    – DJClayworth
    Jul 18 '17 at 2:24




    5




    5




    @DJClayworth Most EU countries allow drinking. Buying is different, but drinking? Yep, legal in most EU countries.
    – Olivier Grégoire
    Jul 18 '17 at 16:20




    @DJClayworth Most EU countries allow drinking. Buying is different, but drinking? Yep, legal in most EU countries.
    – Olivier Grégoire
    Jul 18 '17 at 16:20












    I agree with that.
    – DJClayworth
    Jul 18 '17 at 22:49




    I agree with that.
    – DJClayworth
    Jul 18 '17 at 22:49










    up vote
    4
    down vote













    It's pretty simple. If you're below the legal drinking age it's illegal. No matter what your ID appears to state. You may confuse people but that's all there is to it. And don't assume Europe is not as strict. You may not get challenged as often but there are strict official rules in all countries.






    share|improve this answer
















    • 1




      OP isn't asking about people younger than 18 years old, but rather about people older with documents using different calendar which would suggest they are younger.
      – Kuba
      Jul 18 '17 at 19:41






    • 7




      Uhm, question implies that they are able to show they are older.
      – Paul Palmpje
      Jul 18 '17 at 19:44










    • Ah sorry, I read it the other way around.
      – Kuba
      Jul 18 '17 at 19:54














    up vote
    4
    down vote













    It's pretty simple. If you're below the legal drinking age it's illegal. No matter what your ID appears to state. You may confuse people but that's all there is to it. And don't assume Europe is not as strict. You may not get challenged as often but there are strict official rules in all countries.






    share|improve this answer
















    • 1




      OP isn't asking about people younger than 18 years old, but rather about people older with documents using different calendar which would suggest they are younger.
      – Kuba
      Jul 18 '17 at 19:41






    • 7




      Uhm, question implies that they are able to show they are older.
      – Paul Palmpje
      Jul 18 '17 at 19:44










    • Ah sorry, I read it the other way around.
      – Kuba
      Jul 18 '17 at 19:54












    up vote
    4
    down vote










    up vote
    4
    down vote









    It's pretty simple. If you're below the legal drinking age it's illegal. No matter what your ID appears to state. You may confuse people but that's all there is to it. And don't assume Europe is not as strict. You may not get challenged as often but there are strict official rules in all countries.






    share|improve this answer












    It's pretty simple. If you're below the legal drinking age it's illegal. No matter what your ID appears to state. You may confuse people but that's all there is to it. And don't assume Europe is not as strict. You may not get challenged as often but there are strict official rules in all countries.







    share|improve this answer












    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer










    answered Jul 18 '17 at 19:34









    Paul Palmpje

    31137




    31137







    • 1




      OP isn't asking about people younger than 18 years old, but rather about people older with documents using different calendar which would suggest they are younger.
      – Kuba
      Jul 18 '17 at 19:41






    • 7




      Uhm, question implies that they are able to show they are older.
      – Paul Palmpje
      Jul 18 '17 at 19:44










    • Ah sorry, I read it the other way around.
      – Kuba
      Jul 18 '17 at 19:54












    • 1




      OP isn't asking about people younger than 18 years old, but rather about people older with documents using different calendar which would suggest they are younger.
      – Kuba
      Jul 18 '17 at 19:41






    • 7




      Uhm, question implies that they are able to show they are older.
      – Paul Palmpje
      Jul 18 '17 at 19:44










    • Ah sorry, I read it the other way around.
      – Kuba
      Jul 18 '17 at 19:54







    1




    1




    OP isn't asking about people younger than 18 years old, but rather about people older with documents using different calendar which would suggest they are younger.
    – Kuba
    Jul 18 '17 at 19:41




    OP isn't asking about people younger than 18 years old, but rather about people older with documents using different calendar which would suggest they are younger.
    – Kuba
    Jul 18 '17 at 19:41




    7




    7




    Uhm, question implies that they are able to show they are older.
    – Paul Palmpje
    Jul 18 '17 at 19:44




    Uhm, question implies that they are able to show they are older.
    – Paul Palmpje
    Jul 18 '17 at 19:44












    Ah sorry, I read it the other way around.
    – Kuba
    Jul 18 '17 at 19:54




    Ah sorry, I read it the other way around.
    – Kuba
    Jul 18 '17 at 19:54










    up vote
    3
    down vote













    This only applies if the drinking age is over 18



    Ethiopian passports display the date of birth in Gregorian fashion in accordance with international rules, and are thus not of use.



    Ethiopian driving licenses use the local calendar (source) but the legal age of driving in Ethiopia is 18 (see wikipedia) so this of no consequence unless the drinking age is above 18. Note, as well, that the expiry date of the license may be in the "past" if compared to the Gregorian year.



    I am not aware of any other national ID available in Ethiopia.



    And, in any case, the production of ID does not determine legality of drinking






    share|improve this answer
























      up vote
      3
      down vote













      This only applies if the drinking age is over 18



      Ethiopian passports display the date of birth in Gregorian fashion in accordance with international rules, and are thus not of use.



      Ethiopian driving licenses use the local calendar (source) but the legal age of driving in Ethiopia is 18 (see wikipedia) so this of no consequence unless the drinking age is above 18. Note, as well, that the expiry date of the license may be in the "past" if compared to the Gregorian year.



      I am not aware of any other national ID available in Ethiopia.



      And, in any case, the production of ID does not determine legality of drinking






      share|improve this answer






















        up vote
        3
        down vote










        up vote
        3
        down vote









        This only applies if the drinking age is over 18



        Ethiopian passports display the date of birth in Gregorian fashion in accordance with international rules, and are thus not of use.



        Ethiopian driving licenses use the local calendar (source) but the legal age of driving in Ethiopia is 18 (see wikipedia) so this of no consequence unless the drinking age is above 18. Note, as well, that the expiry date of the license may be in the "past" if compared to the Gregorian year.



        I am not aware of any other national ID available in Ethiopia.



        And, in any case, the production of ID does not determine legality of drinking






        share|improve this answer












        This only applies if the drinking age is over 18



        Ethiopian passports display the date of birth in Gregorian fashion in accordance with international rules, and are thus not of use.



        Ethiopian driving licenses use the local calendar (source) but the legal age of driving in Ethiopia is 18 (see wikipedia) so this of no consequence unless the drinking age is above 18. Note, as well, that the expiry date of the license may be in the "past" if compared to the Gregorian year.



        I am not aware of any other national ID available in Ethiopia.



        And, in any case, the production of ID does not determine legality of drinking







        share|improve this answer












        share|improve this answer



        share|improve this answer










        answered Jul 18 '17 at 15:20









        Jack Aidley

        1,959912




        1,959912



























            draft saved

            draft discarded
















































            Thanks for contributing an answer to Travel Stack Exchange!


            • Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!

            But avoid


            • Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.

            • Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.

            To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.





            Some of your past answers have not been well-received, and you're in danger of being blocked from answering.


            Please pay close attention to the following guidance:


            • Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!

            But avoid


            • Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.

            • Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.

            To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.




            draft saved


            draft discarded














            StackExchange.ready(
            function ()
            StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2ftravel.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f98306%2fcan-a-teenage-ethiopian-legally-drink-in-other-countries-using-their-id%23new-answer', 'question_page');

            );

            Post as a guest















            Required, but never shown





















































            Required, but never shown














            Required, but never shown












            Required, but never shown







            Required, but never shown

































            Required, but never shown














            Required, but never shown












            Required, but never shown







            Required, but never shown







            Popular posts from this blog

            𛂒𛀶,𛀽𛀑𛂀𛃧𛂓𛀙𛃆𛃑𛃷𛂟𛁡𛀢𛀟𛁤𛂽𛁕𛁪𛂟𛂯,𛁞𛂧𛀴𛁄𛁠𛁼𛂿𛀤 𛂘,𛁺𛂾𛃭𛃭𛃵𛀺,𛂣𛃍𛂖𛃶 𛀸𛃀𛂖𛁶𛁏𛁚 𛂢𛂞 𛁰𛂆𛀔,𛁸𛀽𛁓𛃋𛂇𛃧𛀧𛃣𛂐𛃇,𛂂𛃻𛃲𛁬𛃞𛀧𛃃𛀅 𛂭𛁠𛁡𛃇𛀷𛃓𛁥,𛁙𛁘𛁞𛃸𛁸𛃣𛁜,𛂛,𛃿,𛁯𛂘𛂌𛃛𛁱𛃌𛂈𛂇 𛁊𛃲,𛀕𛃴𛀜 𛀶𛂆𛀶𛃟𛂉𛀣,𛂐𛁞𛁾 𛁷𛂑𛁳𛂯𛀬𛃅,𛃶𛁼

            Edmonton

            Crossroads (UK TV series)